# what to eat??



## mohrs6 (Aug 26, 2002)

I've had IBS since I can remember - at least 30 years. It tends to go in cycles of C with lots of gas and bloating followed by D or I'll have long periods of just D. All extreamly painful. I've been able to reduce problems considerably with diet. Since I haven't been able to eliminate attacks and my migranes are increasing in frequency and duration my doctor recommended IgG blood testing. My reactive foods are banana, cashews, papaya, kidny beans, lima beans, pinto beans, cow and goat milk, cheese, mushrooms and brewer's yeast. So question 1 is, since I reacted to more than 3 legumes and more than three fungi, do I eliminate all legumes and all fungi during the initial stage and then add back later as a challenge? Legumes are major for me since until last month I was a vegan. I have recently added fish and eggs back into my diet and have felt much better - probably because it reduced the legumes I was eating. I do still use soy milk and soy yogurt (or I did until I got the test results back) which are legumes and I hate to give them up. Question 2, am I correct in thinking that the LEAP MRT test is more sensitive than the IgG? My IgG for Tea came back non-reactive, but I'm pretty sure I am reactive - or could it just be the caffine in the tea that I am reactive to and not the tannins? I'm planning to change my insurance in January and pick one that will cover LEAP since I have 2 daughters that are having problems similar to those that I had at their ages and I'd like to have them leap. However, in the meantime I need to get myself well so I can take care of them.Thanks!Michelle


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## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

Hi MOHRS.Just passing through and saw your post.Any assay for specific immunoglobulins tells you basically one thing: IF you ahe formed that specific immunoglobulin of that type against a specific food, and the Ig[x] formed correlates to the Gel & Xoombs classification system (which is out of date as there are more mechanisms known now...more ways to get different types of immunocytes activated).What it does not tell you is if you have clinical food allergy of that type to that food. Only that you may...it more rules OUT allergy of that type if you do NOT have Ig[x] than it rules IN allergy if you do.See the difference?Now to assess the probabilities you have to hve good history and a good record of thr patients dietary intake patterns matched to symptomoligic patterns. This usually takes so much work and face time that the practitoner simply takes the patient off al those foods just to play it safe. Its harmless as the worst thing that can happen is you tell someone not to eat a carrot or bean who COULD be. As long as the diet is not so restrictive and so unsupported with nutrional supplementation to compensate that nutritional deficiencies occur.The MRT assay patented by Signet and used in the LEAP protocol was contrived by immunologists who have worked with food allergy and intolerance and hypersensitivities and the words-du-jour for decades.KNOWING that there are multiple-pathways by which the many different kinds of ciruclating immune cells can be caused to react abnormally, the effort to try to find every possible "marker" of every possible "reaction" to get the best diet and best outcomes was viewed as somewhat futile. Since even if you DID find every possible marker for every possible type of reaction, in many cases just becasue it is THERE does not mean the patient is clinically reactive only that she MAY be.So, they figured, since it is pretty easy to iaolatre the reactions which occur in the mucosa (mast cell reactions) already but it is hard to evaluate what reactions people ar having via their circulating immune cell types (lymphocytes, granulocytes, platelets. macrophages etc) one day a couple of these guys sitting around a table ata big center in London just sort of asked each other "what is the END POINT of all cellular reactions irrespective of the triggering mechanism?" answer...proinflammatory mediators are released by the cell through on or more methods and into the surrounding tissues and bloodstream.







So since it is a literal nightmare to try to cover all the possible mechanisms of hypersensitivity to all the foods and chemcials to see what specific reaction MAY be occuring why do we not just check for the COMMON END POINT?That is what is important to clinical therapeutics: snce whenever mediators are relased from immunocytes they do damage and act on other tisssues and nerves etc and provoke symptoms, in a symptomatic patient if you can detetct what in the diet provokes a reaction absed on detetcting release of mediators from circulating immune cells, then remove exposure to it, then symptoms should diminish no?yes.So it may have taken some years of work and research BUT that is what they ended up doing: creating the test goal first, then creating the methods, technology, and know how to detetct the common end point of all non-allergic (non IgE...non Mast Cell)reactions. Since you can already detetc IgE allergy pretty accurately even without tests (justa good history will usually tell you) the real problem has been detetcting the cell mediated reactions. If you can do that, put the two together and you have EVERY possible source of symptoms EXCEPT the one that no in vitro assay can detect snce it is a direct-reaction between a "food component" and a mucosal cell...for lack of a better word "pseudo allergy" or false-allergy.The ebst example is them legumes. Now you can test negative to legume reactivity cellulary with an MRT and test negative to legume reactivity by allergy (IgE) and even do the other Ig[x] assay like IgG, IgG4 eta l and see nada. BUT you could still get gut symptoms when you eat the legumes.This can be from a substance in the beans called lectins and have nothing to do with proper digestion or Ig[x] allergy etc. Simply put the lectins can directly interract with the mast cells in the intestine and make them degranulate, releasing their mediators and causing symptoms.This is one of the reasons that, for example, if you have been tested like you have and are positive as you describe, this icnrease the probability that you may suffer allergy or pseudoallergy and should remove all the legumes from your diet for now. You could be said to show signs of being "predisposed" to intolerance.Anyway, by explaining the MRT, one could say it is more sensitivie as it takes a different and more physiologic approach: so it does not matter if you do or do not have Ig[x] to some food...if you have no reaction to the food as the common end point of mediatior release does not occur then you are not clinically reactive. But if you DO then regardkess of the mechanism you are reactive and should avoid te food or chemical.The best way I can explain an analogy is to go to Afghanistan and try to determin if a battle is going on by looking for machine guns lying around on the ground in a given area.Now if there are NONE, this decreases the probability that a battle has been fought or is being fought but does not rule it out since maybe they did not USE machine guns...maybe they used rifles and mortars.On the other hand if there ARE machine guns lying around this increases the PROBABILITY that a battle was or is being fought since somehow some machine guns got there, presumably by someone shooting it getting killed and then carried off by the medics. BUT IT DOES NOT diagnose a battle. maybe they just fell of a trcuk passing through, or had no ammunition so the troop threw them away to lighten the load...who knows?See?HOWEVER, go to the abttlefiled and find BLOOD ALL OVER THE PLACE and DEAD BODIES...well this is a much higher probaility quotient.See?So it is not that other tests like this are not useful as they can be if one understands HOW to use the information they give, and hwat they do say and do not say.Plus even if it IS diagnostic, it is only ONE of MANY MECHANISMS POSSIBLE being looked at so you can be perfectly absent any antibodies to any food (like me) and still get sick as a junkyard dog from cell mediated reactions to some food or chemical.The best perspective is that Ig[x] testing and MRT testing are complementary not synonymous nor mutually exclusive. The best mechanic tends to be the one who has mastery of and access to all the present tools available.Oops outta time cu later sorry so long winded. and no time to fix the typosMNL


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## mohrs6 (Aug 26, 2002)

Mike - Thanks for your response.I think (but am not positive) that I understand. Both IgG and MRT give information, but nothing is conclusive.So what I'll do is cut out all the offending foods for 3 weeks and see if the reactions are gone. If so I'll do some oral challenges to see what, if anything, I can add back. I'll be camping for 2 weeks so it will be easy to control what I eat.


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## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

Clarification: _______________________________________"Both IgG and MRT give information, but nothing is conclusive." ________________________________________OK you are almost there. A test like RAST or ELISA for IgG antibodies to a food will tell you about that one type of reaction...that it may be present...so you want to evaluate that food for reactivity.However you could be IgE and IgG negative to that food and still be reactive, just by a different mechanism that cannot be detected by those tests since no specific antibody is involved.This is the case with the majority of IBS -d-type symptoms. Immunoglobulin specific toa food which produces gut symptoms are only present in maybe 8-10% of IBS victims. Allergy is "comorbid" not at the root of the symptoms. It is most often a cell-mediated reaction. THIS is what the MRT test checks for...all the other possibilities of circulating immune cell reactions which could occur in the small intestine and its structures.In-body tests like jejunla isolation challenges and small bowel biopsy have just discovered and confirmed these types of reactions (involving non-allergic immune cell reactions) are involved in symptom generation i IBS d-types just in the last few years (done in Europe).So this is why you will get better esults with an MRT absed diet than an allergy-test based diet. Most of the problem is NOT food reaction slinked to specific antibodies. It is other alternative mechanisms and all of them have the same end point. So the MRT checks for that end point.Clearer?







Now, that being said the way to check which of the IgG positives are true psitives is to do exactly what you said. get off all of them completely and see how much symptom reduction you get.Hey enjoy the camping trip...I think I have reached the age where, to me, camping is when you have to stay at the Comfort Inn instead of the Marriott.







MNLPSif you read these threads and the cases presented there you will come to see that, in the case of IBS victims with diarrheic related symptoms, the LEAP protocol based upon the MRT assay suggests the MRT assay is pretty conclusive for the types of intolrance reactions which occur in the gutz of this type of person. http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...=4;t=000286;p=4 http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...pic;f=4;t=00028 6;p=3#000106[/URL] http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=4;t=000364 http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...=4&DaysPrune=30 http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=4;t=000286 http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=4;t=000285 http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=4;t=000331#00 0001[/URL] http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=4;t=000302 http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=4;t=000287 http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=4;t=000364 http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=5&t=000313&p=[/UR L]http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=00029 3;p=2#000069 http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=4;t=000276 http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=5;t=000073 http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=5&t=000356&p=[/UR L] http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=000320#00 0016http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=4&t=000383#00 0010[/URL] http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=5&t=000126&p=[/UR L] http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=17;t=000033 http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=5;t=000363#00 0002[/URL] http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=1;t=028290#00 0001[/URL] http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=4;t=000335#00 0009[/URL] http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=1&t=028290&p=[/UR L]http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=000353 http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=4;t=000389 http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=4&t=000427#00 0006[/URL] http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=4;t=000421 http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=4&t=000427#00 0015[/URL]


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