# DANGERS OF SOY



## 20721 (Sep 24, 2006)

soy is NOT good for you.ive been a vegetarian for quite some time and recently while working at a health food store i learned that soy is NOT good for you.especially if you have hypothyroidism.drink almond/rice milk instead. and read labels there is soy in nearly everything.i noticed an improved difference in my energy levels and even dropped a few pounds after eliminating soy products.


----------



## Jeanne D (Nov 14, 2001)

I'm surprised to hear this. I thought soy was beneficial for your heart and for your hormones also.Jeanne


----------



## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

There is a lot of conflicting data for soy and there are strong advocates on both sides of the debate.I'm not sure, personally, where the truth lies. I'm wondering if (and this tends to be the moderate position) the traditional soy foods like tofu and miso may be OK in fairly decent amounts but that when you get to some of the vegetarian diets where people get most of their protien from industrially-processed concentrated soy protein stuff that it may be possible to tip the balance into too much of a good thing range.I know someone who has been on both sides of that debate. At one point he was an everyone should eat as much soy as possible type, and he did feel better when he switched to the no one should ever eat any soy or any sort version of nutritional thought.So I think both sides have a point, but that it probably is safe and heart healthy and all that in moderate amount particularly if you stick to more traditional soy foods for most of your moderate consuption of soy. However anytime a "super" food gets proclaimed you will get those who eat a lot more of it than anyone that they based the original diet studies on from a culture that traditionally eats it.Many foods are like that. Very healthy, very good when eating in moderation and usually in the traditional way. But when you get into over-processed modern food production methods where you are not eating it in a natural way in tradiational amounts you can overdo it to the point you get side effects.Broccoli/Cabbage gets some of the same issues. In moderate amounts it does seem to be protective for various cancers and all sorts of healthy things, but there are people who have been on restricted diets that had not much else to eat that got enough cabbage that they had thyroid issues.


----------



## 22943 (Aug 27, 2005)

If soy is so bad for you, why don't we hear about the Asian communities having health issues because of it? I've met lots of Japanese people who eat it almost everyday and do not encounter health issues because of it. Of course too much of anything isn't good, but I think in moderation it should be fine to eat. I've tried the rice and almond milks and just can't do them and since I've found out I'm allergic to cow dairy products, it's all I've got to drink if I want milk.


----------



## KLG (Jul 8, 2002)

I agree with you to a degree. I think in moderation it is okay...but I don't think it should be in everything we eat (which it is) and I also wonder, if soy is high in phytoestrogens why it is in a lot of the foods we eat. Men and young children, girls or boys probably shouldn't eat it since it alters hormone levels (although maybe its phytoestrogen properties are diminished during processing...I really don't know. Asian countries may be well adjusted to it, its been around there much longer than here. Its a cheap filler here...I don't know, but I will say this... I think Asian men are probably eating too much of it, no man should be eating that much "estrogen".


----------



## Cherrie (Sep 1, 2006)

Ha, ha, ha, I_H8_IBS -- (sorry, I just had to laugh -- PLEASE PLEASE forgive me, I really really don't mean to offend anyone from any culture). Rest assured, men from Japan or Asia in general may look petit, their health is certainly not affected by eating soy -- after all, there are so many very densely populated areas in there







)On another note, TOO MUCH concentrated soy (processed in the modern way) certainly is NOT good, especially for men -- I heard that it weaken's their kidney


----------



## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Tofu and miso are not nearly as concentrated as some of the soy protien drinks or fake meat products.Like anything some is good, but you can go too far. Especially when you let modern industrial food production take something and concentrate it.AND...there are scare mongers for just about every processed food item out there. Anything in moderation is going to for the average individual be safe.There are always a few people who are unusually sensitive to something, but that some people can't be in a room with an open peanut butter jar (for example) should not dictate the average person's diet.K.


----------



## 23392 (Jan 31, 2006)

What I remember hearing from my doc [and I can check this with him again] is that it is the way soy is *processed* in America, at least, in particular, that causes problems. Not so much the soy as it is handled in Japan, for instance.And Kathleen is right: think of butter. Or good southern home cooking! When my great-grandparents put in a hard day of physical labor, and had a bit of this, it just restored their calories. When people live sedentary lives and eat a lot, we know what good ol' butter, fried foods and some other fats can do! ;-)things in moderation...and per your activity level!


----------



## 15343 (Sep 25, 2006)

so if i correctly understood,- processed soy is dangerous for the health and not soy in the natural state?i always thought that soy was very much beneficial to the health. I am also confused


----------



## 23392 (Jan 31, 2006)

What i have understood is that the way soy is processed by Western companies for western foods is different from the way it is processed in, say, Japan for a Japanese clientele. The western processing is problematical.However, this is only what i have *heard;* I do not have any actual studies so was curious to see if there were leads to anythign or even documentation of how the processing is different.


----------



## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

I'm not sure I have seen any evidence other than what can be found on the "Soy is Evil" websites.Soy Protien Isolate is typically not the soy that is consumed in large quantities in Japan and China (tofu, miso, soybeans) where a lot of the idea that soy in the diet is good studies came from.The "Portfolio Diet" study used a lot of soy of all kinds in addition to lots of other diet components that can reduce cholesterol and I do not recall them seeing the severe, debilitating, life-ending side effects the "Soy is Evil" websites see.I do know that it is not uncommon for there to be this sort of problem in dietary studies. We look at a group of people who have better health by some measure, see what they are eating, extract it out of foods and give it to people as supplements and find that it is having a different effect. You see this with antioxidants. People whose diet is high in these things from food tend to have lower cancer rates. Yet when you give antioxidant supplement to people at risk for cancer it seems they are more likely to get cancer when taking the supplements.So I could see they miight have a point, which is why I'm in the as long as you are doing it in moderation you should be OK. One of the people I know that switched from "Soy is the perfect food eat tons of it every day" to "Soy is Evil" did notice a difference in how he felt. However he was eating way more soy than I think most people do because he was using it more like a drug and less like a food that is just one part of the diet.While this abstract doesn't say much it does show that people are looking at this issue.


> quoteroduction and processing of soybeans and nutrition and safety of isoflavone and other soy products for human health.Choi MS, Rhee KC. Department of Food Science and Nutrition, College of Human Ecology, Kyungpook National University, Daegu, Korea. mschoi###knu.ac.krFunctional foods are intended to help consumers reduce or manage the risks for certain diseases while maintaining body function and structure. Functional foods are regulated differently depending upon the country. For example, the United States has not defined the term functional food in regulation. Thus, functional foods are treated just like conventional foods for obtaining regulatory safety approval. However, the sales of soy products, soy-enriched foods, and dietary supplements have grown tremendously during the past 3 years because of the increasing consumer awareness of soy as a healthy food ingredient. Isoflavones in soy are believed to have preventive effects for several hormone-dependent diseases, mainly due to their weak estrogenic activity. This mini-review discusses some of the important issues to be considered in using soy and isoflavone products as health foods, including production, composition, products, and processing of soy products, and the fate of isoflavones during processing, their bioavailability, and safety. Some of these issues may affect the choice of raw or basic material sources, processing conditions, quality control procedures/measures, and marketing strategies for both soy-based foods and isoflavones.


There is also this article in the British Medical Journal that seems to be available free on-line http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/full/331/7511/254-a It discusses various concerns about soy, but from the comments they are wrong that soy infant formula is only available by prescription in some countries.However most of the concern I see in the medical lit. on the effect on infants more than adults.FWIW the "soy is dangerous" crowd does have a point in that most of the "soy is the bestest food ever" promoters are taking scant data and making it look better than it really is, but then everyone selling any food, vitamin, or extracted food part as healthy does that. The truth is typically somewhere inbetween the two extreme positions. K.


----------



## Cherrie (Sep 1, 2006)

Thanks, Kathleen, for the info! Really appreciate it 'cause i'm already a vegetarian and don't want to be losing an important source of protein!


----------

