# Is the MRT test quackery?



## gfinster (Jan 11, 2001)

Sorry to be negative here but I was researching the "patented MRT" test and found it listed on the Quackwatch website as a dubious test with no backing from the traditional medical community. http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRelate...ests/tests.html I know many on this bb are very pro alternative medicine and anti traditional medicine. Frankly I'm sceptical of both but I do support hard science and data findings. I found the information on the MRT test on the leap website to be very scanty at best. I'm assuming this is to protect their patent and their opportunity for making a profit. If it is a true breakthrough in medicine then why not share it with the medical community. Sell it to some drug company and make your profit that way so that many more can benefit from this "breakthrough". Keeping it confined to this one website is not helping the millions of people who could benefit from this blood test within the confines of traditional medicine.I tested positive to soy, peanut and coconut on an allergy skin prick test and have eliminated these things from my diet. It has made a WORLD OF DIFFERENCE in my IBS which I have suffered with for over 20 years (C&D alternating). I was very excited about getting more info on other things that I might be sensitive to and am currently researching ways to detect other allergens. The quackwatch site guy has been published in med journals and Time magazine has also done a story on him and he's made the morning tv circuit. He is widely read and seen as a source for what's good and what's quackery. If the MRT test is truly scientifically sound, then please explain.Thanks, seeking


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

I took the MRT testing with LEAP..but I made sure I called my insurance company first to make sure it was all legal...and they called me back the next day after they did there research and all was well







It didnt matter because money wasnt involved ...When I shared my story here on the board Mike was the one that said I think I can help and even if you look back in old post he wanted to do the testing free for me...He just wanted to show that it worked for others that had the symptoms that I did but I still wanted to check with my insurance first even though the testing was not going to cost me a penny.. They gave me the medical code and I called LEAP and got my blood test....I still have a hard time with people doing stuff for me so that is why I got the insurance company involved.. *I am serious the best thing that I ever did* Here is alittle info below that I found about the one I took...I guess there is all kinds of information out there on the internet....The website was to














Executive Summary:Newly Patented Blood Test Addresses Mass Market (NEW LISTING!!)Signet developed, secured multiple patents, successfully test marketed and established a startup core of providers of services and products based on Its' proprietary blood analysis technology. This was accomplished in their geographic area of southeast Florida and test-projected nationwide between 1993-2000. Seeking expansion capital for a DMA-based rollout in the top 45 U.S. DMA's. Canada, Europe and Australasia to follow. Affiliate laboratories are in place. Signet has also assembled a core of respected doctors and dieticians as advocates to support the rollout. The "Mediator Release Test" (MRT) "directs" a set of turnkey Wellness Programs trademarked "LEAP" (Lifestyle, Eating and Performance). The testing and programs will be marketed via existing small-facility and large-facility-based healthcare delivery sites. The MRT is insurance reimbursable. 260+ PPO's paid for MRT tests during the FLA. test market. LEAP will be concurrently marketed "direct-to-consumer" via a LEAP Home Care Program. An Athletic Performance Program co-developed with a Major University Sports Dept. will be marketed to NCAA and professional sports. A number of NFL players already tested. About 100,000,000 Americans suffer non-allergic food and food-additive sensitivities ("non allergy" immune responses). Over 30 million Irritable Bowel Syndrome sufferers plus migraine and non migraine headache, chronic fatigue, even ADD and Autism victims show these reactions now accurately detectable with MRT. Offending substances can be avoided and symptoms subside. Signet will also import an effective OTC immuno-modulating supplement as an adjunct for IBS, and has formulated a targeted vitamin/mineral supplement. http://www.worldweb.com/UBS/Signet.html *********************************************Here is the same Dr's opinion of IBS...he seems to stress alot about food and IBS and not talk much about the brain gut connection....seems like he needs to get some more knowledgeIrritable Bowel SyndromeStephen Barrett, M.D.Irritable bowel syndrome (IBS) -- also called irritable or spastic colon -- is a common functional intestinal disorder characterized by recurrent abdominal discomfort and abnormal bowel function. The discomfort often begins after eating and goes away after a bowel movement. The symptoms can include cramps, bloating, constipation, diarrhea, and a feeling of incomplete emptying.IBS occurs in about one in five Americans, more commonly in women, and more often at times of emotional stress. It usually begins in late adolescence or early adult life and rarely starts after the age of 50. In severe cases, it can result in missed work days and curtailment of social activities. Although effective help is available, many people with IBS are too embarrassed, pessimistic, or afraid to seek medical care. Even worse, some people who consult a doctor receive insufficient guidance and conclude that nothing further can be done for them.Why Symptoms OccurDuring normal digestion, foods are broken down in the stomach and small intestine so that their nutrients can be absorbed into the body. Undigested or partially digested portions -- mostly in liquid form -- then enter the large intestine (colon) where most of the water is reabsorbed. Movement through the intestines results from peristalsis, a wavelike contraction of muscles in the intestinal walls that propel their contents forward. When all is well, the end result is stool that is solid but soft enough to be excreted easily.Diet, eating habits, stress, and various environmental factors can disrupt the normal function of the intestines. If the intestines squeeze too hard or not enough, the partially digested food can travel too rapidly or too slowly through the digestive system. Movement that is too fast will result in diarrhea, because not enough water is reabsorbed. Movement that is too slow can result in constipation, because too much water is absorbed. Overly hard squeezing (spasm) can result in cramps. However, the diarrhea of IBS can also occur without pain.IBS symptoms occur after eating because of the gastrocolic reflex -- increased movement of the intestinal contents in response to food entering the stomach. The strength of this reflex can be influenced by the volume and temperature of the food and the number of calories. Large meals (particularly high-fat meals) and large amounts of cold beverages can trigger IBS attacks.Medical EvaluationA thorough history and physical examination should be obtained. The extent of further evaluation depends on the patient's age, general health, and symptoms. If symptoms have been present a long time and have a typical pattern, the doctor may rely mainly on the patient's description to diagnose IBS. If symptoms are recent in origin, testing may be needed to be certain that an infection, inflammation, or tumor is not responsible for the symptoms. The tests may include blood tests, stool tests, x-ray examinations, and endoscopy (examination of the colon with a hollow tubular instrument inserted from below).Management TipsThe first step in managing IBS should be to identify what triggers the symptoms. The factors to consider include food intolerances, eating habits, dietary factors, emotional stress, exercise habits, use of laxatives, and vitamin C intake. It may help to keep a diary that relates symptoms to daily activities.Many people with IBS have difficulty digesting lactose (milk sugar). This results from a shortage of lactase, an enzyme normally produced by cells lining the small intestine. Lactase breaks down milk sugar into simpler substances that are absorbed into the bloodstream. When there is not enough lactase, undigested lactose can ferment in the large intestine and cause nausea, cramps, bloating, flatulence, and diarrhea that begin about 30 minutes to 2 hours after consuming lactose-containing foods. The severity of symptoms varies with the amount of lactose the individual can tolerate. To determine whether lactose intolerance is a factor in IBS, the patient can experiment to see whether symptoms are related to milk intake. Laboratory testing may also be useful. If lactose intolerance is significant, lactase drops or tablets can be added to ordinary milk, low-lactose products can be substituted, or dairy products can be avoided (in which case the patient should take calcium supplements).Bloating or excessive gas can also be related to eating habits and diet. Drinking carbonated beverages can introduce gas into the intestines and cause abdominal pain. Eating or drinking rapidly, chewing gum, smoking, nervously gulping air, or wearing loose dentures can cause some people to swallow a large amount of air, some of which reaches the large intestine. Gas can also be produced by such foods as beans, onions, broccoli, and cabbage. Eating more slowly or minimizing gas-forming foods may help.Since caffeine can increase intestinal motility, people with IBS should avoid or minimize the use of caffeine-containing beverages such as coffee and caffeinated colas. Fructose or sorbitol (a sugar substitute) can induce diarrhea in some people. Since vitamin C supplements of 1 gram/day or more can cause diarrhea, patients with chronically loose stools should be advised to stop taking them.Unnecessary delay in defecation should be avoided. When an urge is felt, leaving the stool in the colon may contribute to constipation because the longer the contents remain, the more fluid may be absorbed. Use of certain laxatives can perpetuate constipation because the large intestine can become dependent on them. People with IBS should not take strong laxatives.Increasing the fiber content of the diet or taking a stool softener such as methylcellulose or psyllium may help regulate bowel movements and reduce both constipation and diarrhea. Increasing dietary fiber should be done gradually to give the body time to adjust. Prescription drugs are available to slow the movement of food through the intestines or to relieve intestinal spasm.In patients with abdominal pain, medication, a hot bath, or a hot water bottle applied to the abdomen may relieve an acute attack. Antispasmodics can also prevent attacks. If a certain type of activity is known to trigger an attack, taking an antispasmodic drug beforehand may prevent trouble. If modifiable sources of stress can be discovered, resolving them may help. Regular exercise can also help to normalize bowel action.Quackwatch Home Page


----------



## flux (Dec 13, 1998)

The test is on there because as you discovered information about it is minimal and there hasn't been anything really published to support the claims behind it. There is little evidence in general that food intolerance is a real phenomenon of major clinical signficance. That is, there may in fact be something to it, but it is probably fairly rare.Another point is that the best studies actually come from lactose intolerance, which although not the same thing as an immunological intolerance, suggest that people have difficulty in figuring out what foods bother them (if any indeed do).


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

I forgot to say that I am so glad that you feel better after you stoped eating those foods...Isnt it hard to believe how much food and additives can make us feel so bad...Mike will be here to explain their new test that has been out for only two years...Glad to you feel much better







Flux on your statement below the Doctors I went to had all kinds of evidence what was triggering my IBS...I listened to them and now I am minus a gallbladder and every other organ in my body...Evidence is in the eye of the beholder....







QUOTE************************There is little evidence in general that food intolerance is a real phenomenon of major clinical signficance


----------



## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Once we get a couple of well-controlled studies in the medical lit (assuming that they can be done or there is any interest in doing them) it could move out of the dubious tests to an accepted test mode. The problem is until those get published it is really hard to judge the claims. You can publish in the medical lit and not void out your patent rights.I'm not sure how good the "insurance paid for it" arguement is. Some insurance companies are moving to covering any number of alternative treatments that don't have good evidence for them because that is what patients want. Gives them a cut of the "alt. med" market. I mean when you get the choice between an insurance co that pays for your chiropractic, and massage and aroma therapy (or whatever is your bag) vs one that doesn't, considering that a very sizable number of people pay for alt. med services anyway.... it is a good way to get people to your insurance company vs someone else who doesn't cover stuff you are currently paying for.K.


----------



## WashoeLisa (Sep 12, 2000)

Hi!I can definitely understand your concerns and wanting to make sure you are not fleeced by yet another no-good medical exam.I felt that way too before I took it. I checked it out as Donna showed here and felt it was on the up and up- so I decided to take the test.Just to point out, it is a ture blood test, no alternative medicine involved here. I was being followed by my PCP, my acunpuncturist (who is an MD as well) AND my chiropractor- they all wanted to see this test in action, in a real patient. My acupuncturist and chiro had not heard of it, but my PCP had read about it in a journal somewhere (not sure which one). After I got my results, I started the diet program and within 6 weeks, I was off all my meds, feeling better than I ever had in my entire life (I've had GI problems since I was born) and amazing my doctors at the turnabout it health I had. It has been almost 2 years since then and no placebo effect lasts that long. Since then, my daughter, my dad, my cousin, and several family friends have taken the test- with many more checking into it and others considering it- just all based on how well I did. I wish I could show you before and after pictures of me- my family told me that before, I looked kinda grey, and in alot of pain. Now, the sparkle is back in my eyes, my skin is a healthy pink again and I am doing great! My husband and children were so grateful to MikeNL and Signet Labs for giving "me" back to them. It was really that great of a change.I understand the Quackwatch guy is well respected but he also judged a product as it was on its way into the masses.There are lots of reasons why the test is still only on one webpage, which I'll let MikeNL address. BUT no drug company will touch this test, because they make NO money from repeat customers as they do with pharmeceuticals. I, for one, was spending about $200-$300 per month on meds alone for my IBS, FM and CFIDS. Now I spend about $15 per year(my co-pay) for a bottle of Celebrex(30 capsules) that lasts me all year- adn I have some I have to throw away at the end of its shelf life.MikeNL is is the process of marketing it nationwide- that's why he is on his cross country tour right now. Like Donna, it was the BEST thing I EVER did for my health. And I have even been to UCLA as well the the best FM doc in the country for treatment.I am glad you are being so skeptical to protect yourself, we all should be. But my story speaks for itself, as does my daugher's , my dad's, my friends', Donna's, WD40's, Julia's and on and on.Flux,you really do need to come up with some better comebacks. Its the same thing you've been writing all along and it has been addressed over and over...All my best,Lisa from NevadaP.S. You don't have to believe me. I am here to try to be the kind of person I wish had told me about this years ago, so I wouldn't have wasted all that time begin so sick. But what you do is up to you. All I can do is lay out the truth and let you make up your own mind.


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

Hey Lisa







I was on all kinds of medicine too...zofran, phenegran, every SSRI in the world, medicine for anxiety and depression & pain ...Still paying for all kinds of medical bills...but I havent taken one pill of any kind in along time...I was very doubtful at first...It was like no way but much to my surprize it worked as long as I work at it...and for me its real easy to stay away from the triggers for me...Every day that goes by is a blessing


----------



## WashoeLisa (Sep 12, 2000)

Hi Donna,Yes,I was surprised too at how much better I got! I was hoping to get control of my GI problems (including, but not just, IBS) through this test.I NEVER, NEVER, NEVER hoped in my wildest dremas that it would be the key to controling my FM and CFIDS too.I was hoping to drop maybe 2-3 meds out of my daily 15 and was shocked to find I could drop them ALL.Some people have asked me why I think it helps my FM and CFIDS too- because it hasn't helped everyone in that department the way it helped me. For me, I think its one less stressor on my body and its just enough to keep the FM and CFIDS quiet because I do get flares when I get run down or the flu or just not enough sleep.I am so glad you are on THIS side of IBS, with me, now. It truly is an amazing and wonderful thing!Hugs,Lisa from Nevada


----------



## eric (Jul 8, 1999)

A website for IBS information. http://www.med.unc.edu/medicine/fgidc/ Top of this page is a video on IBS. http://www.med.unc.edu/medicine/fgidc/library.htm


----------



## flux (Dec 13, 1998)

> quote:Its the same thing you've been writing all along and it has been addressed over and over...


Mike has just indicated that there is no funding available to *begin* addressing it.


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

Comment...1. The Quackbuster has no idea what LEAP is nor clearly ever looked at it after posting his uninformed comments over 18 months ago.Another viewpoint... ________________________________What's eating Stephen Barrett?by Burton GoldbergJuly 1998Alternative Medicine DigestHe says he's using science to protect the public from expensive fad diagnoses, but if this "quackbuster" has his way, the public will have no recourse but conventional medicine for their health problems. RECENTLY, I set myself the exercise of trying to understand what motivates a self proclaimed "quackbuster" to write a book debunking an entire field of medicine. A "quackbuster," as we've come to know over the years, is someone who is dedicated to casting aspersions on alternative medicine, regardless of whether there is any factual basis. As alternative medicine continues to grow more popular - an estimated 42% of Americans now use it - the "quackbusters" are growing more clamorous in their denunciations of our field. They have to be - they're almost a minority view.Highly visible among these self appointed "quackbusters" is Stephen Barrett, M.D., a retired psychiatrist, author of numerous books, and spokesman for the "Quackwatch" community. In his latest book, Chemical Sensitivity: The Truth About Environmental Illness, coauthored with Ronald E. Gots, M.D., Ph.D (Prometheus Books, 1998), Barrett goes after all the illness categories for which diet and chemical exposure are "falsely blamed."Multiple chemical sensitivity, sick building syndrome, food related hyperactivity, mercury amalgam toxicity, candidiasis hyperactivity, Gulf War syndrome - these are all costly misbeliefs and fad diagnoses, says Barrett. "Many Americans believe that exposure to common foods and chemicals makes them ill," he says. "This book is about people who hold such beliefs but are wrong."Not only are patients wrong, Barrett says, they are "financially exploited as well as mistreated." They are duped by "farfetched" notions and "dubious claims," by headline-crazed media and "toxic television," and by "physicians who use questionable diagnostic and treatment methods."Patients presume they are being made allergic or toxic or even being poisoned by the mass of modern chemicals, cosmetics, cleaning agents, drugs, and other human-made substances. They are mistaken, says Barrett. Their misbeliefs are especially hard to understand, Barrett says, "at a time when our food supply is the world's safest and our antipollution program is the best we've ever had."Patients' symptoms are mental (psychosomatic) in origin - "they react to stress by developing multiple symptoms." Their symptoms are not caused by chemicals or dietary factors, he says. In fact, Barrett suggests that some patients are "hysterical," others are "paranoid," and the rest have "certain psychological factors" that "predispose" them to "develop symptoms" and to seek out "questionable" doctors (meaning alternative medicine practitioners) who will attach a ("not scientifically recognized") disease label to them.Regarding Gulf War syndrome, for example, Barrett declares: "It provides a feeding trough for serious scientists, since funding is abundant, and for every charlatan with a newsworthy theory." On the matter of the dangers of mercury fillings, he states: "The false diagnosis of mercury amalgam toxicity is potentially very harmful and reflects extremely poor judgment."For the most part, of the illnesses listed above, nearly all are mere "labels" rather than legitimate illness conditions, asserts Barrett; they're not caused by foods or chemicals; there are no "scientific"" studies conclusively proving the association of diet, chemicals, and illness; and we are best advised to dismiss them out of hand, he says.In most cases and for most of the illnesses commonly associated with chemical sensitivity, Barrett says the mass of mistaken patients would be better off seeking "mental help" from a psychiatrist or other "mental health practitioner." Alternative medicine physicians and especially "clinical ecologists" (the old name for practitioners of environmental medicine, which links exposures to toxic substances with health conditions) should be chastised, investigated, put on notice, and if possible, put out of business, says Barrett.Most of what Barrett claims can be refuted, easily and decisively. That's not my intention here. I'm more interested in looking at the bigger picture - what is Barrett really saying amidst his quackbusting bluster, and why?Barrett appears to be saying that the typical American patient is stupid, hysterical or paranoid, easily duped, and generally incapable of making a rational, correct medical decision on their own. The patient is mistaken and wrong in thinking their multiple symptoms have any connection to the foods they eat or the environmental chemicals to which they are exposed. The media is irresponsible and not to be trusted as an information source about medicine, especially about alternatives. Doctors who practice alternative medicine are unscientific, opportunistic frauds or quacks, peddling flawed or junk science So who can you turn to - who is not on Barrett's hit list? Conventional doctors. Barrett doesn't say this outright, but it's the only logical conclusion. His message is the old and familiar one from the l950s: the (conventional) doctor knows best.I next pondered what could be the purpose of this book. What could be the result of debunking the connection between foods, chemicals, cosmetics, and drugs with the varieties of environmental illness (mentioned above) now afflicting millions of patients. Why does Barrett (and his colleagues) so dislike alternative medicine? What's eating him that he must disparage the field at every opportunity?The purpose has to be this: to corral this mass of suffering "confused" patients into the treatment pen of conventional medicine. But here Barrett's rationale collapses. The patients end up with nothing.Surely no person suffering unexplained allergies or general toxicity wants to be told they're stupid, mistaken, and ought to have their head examined. And surely no patient who has abandoned conventional medicine (because the one or two dozen doctors they consulted hadn't a clue as to how to help them) would be interested in Barrett's thesis. It is genuinely hard to imagine how a suffering patient could actually be persuaded by Barrett to dismiss alternative approaches when the conventional ones were not useful, or even worse, were harmful.But let's say, despite these reservations, patients allowed themselves to be herded into Barrett's allopathic corral. There would be nothing there for them. Conventional medicine has no cure or treatment for these illnesses. In fact, as Barrett repeatedly points out, for the most part, conventional medicine does not even validate the existence of these illness categories and regards a diagnosis of such illnesses as bogus medicine. Of course, Barrett does offer patients "mental help."Let's look at this setup carefully. Barrett and his "quackbusting" colleagues say they are working to protect the public against health frauds. They don't want the public to waste its money on "sham" treatments that don't work. The false labels of multiple chemical sensitivity, environmental illness, and the rest, do the public a "disservice," Barrett says, and seeking treatment for these wastes the financial resources of insurance companies, employers, and other third party reimbursers.But since conventional medicine has nothing to offer patients who "believe" they are suffering physical distress from these conditions, the patients, in effect, are left on their own to suffer some more. Barrett's plan seems to be to corral these misguided patients into the conventional medicine pen so he can dissuade them of their mistaken notions regarding their illness and make them "see" that it's all psychosomatic.Clearly the patients do not benefit at all from this scenario, so who does? The makers of drugs, petrochemicals, cosmetics, synthetic food additives, pesticides, prepared foods - in short, the massive food and chemical industry of North America benefits. They are no longer held accountable as causal factors in multiple symptom illnesses. They are let off the hook. They can proceed with business as usual. There are no poisons in their products. (See the cartoon about "quackbusters" by Harley Schwadron in "The Politics of Medicine" section, this issue, p. 106.)In the paradox of "quackbusting," the quackbusters say they're protecting public health, but in fact, they're abandoning the public to their own suffering to protect the financial interests of conventional medicine, which has no interest in or ability to produce benefits for these conditions. The "quackbusters" say they're serving the public, but the truth is they're grossly disserving patients. Thanks to Barrett's remarkable chemical insensitivity, a great many patients will be left to suffer on their own without any diagnosis or treatment, except perhaps another round of Prozac on the house.Reproduced with permissionAlternative Medicine Digest, July 1998 ALTERNATIVE MEDICINE ONLINE __________________________________"There is little evidence in general that food intolerance is a real phenomenon of major clinical signficance. That is, there may in fact be something to it, but it is probably fairly rare." ____________________________________This freqeuntly made claim is quite simply not fact, posted by those unfamiliar with the subject in toto. Documentation dates all the way from the 1980's and up through the most recent work on jejunal isolation studies in Sweden.Further disinformation: _________________________________________"Another point is that the best studies actually come from lactose intolerance, which although not the same thing as an immunological intolerance, suggest that people have difficulty in figuring out what foods bother them (if any indeed do)." ___________________________________________This is simply obfuscatory....some of the best studies deal directly with immunologic actcivation and provocation mechanisms within the bowel in response to oral challenge...and the use of immunomodulation which supresses the symptoms.LActose intolerance is well known to be symptom generating mechanism seprate and apart from the food hypersensitivity mechanisms which are involved in generating IBS symptom sets...it is a comorbidity at best....has nothing to do with the subject at hand whatsoever.If one wants to understnd food and chemical hypersensitivity and its role in symptom generation, and remission, in what is commonly called "IBS"....One can start with the Merck Manual here... _________________________________Current Merck Manual: "RECENTLY FOOD INTOLERANCE WAS FOUND TO BE RESPONSIBLE FOR SYMPTOMS OF SOME PATIENTS WITH THE IRRITABLE BOWEL SYNDROME, CONFIRMED BY DOUBLE-BLIND FOOD CHALLENGE. AN INCREASE IN RECTAL PROSTAGLANDIN LEVELS WAS NOTED WHEN A REACTION OCCURRED. PRELIMINARY INFORMATION SUGGESTS THE SAME PHENOMENON MAY TAKE PLACE IN PATIENTS WITH CHRONIC ULCERATIVE COLITIS." ___________________________________A Disease Mangment Program, such as LEAP, incorporates needs assessment tools and protocols to isolate those patients who characterize the patient which can potentially benefit, from those who are least likely to benefit, then enter those who can benefit into the Program. In this case the population which is most likely to benefit is that which is commonly identified as "diarrheic IBS" or "cyclic D&C" subpopulations. Properly diagnosed these represent better than 2/3 of that population and this is the population where the outcomes will be the best and for whom the protocol was developed by the doctors and dieticians who developed it.And as I have distributed many times before to many people who have emailed asking for it, I have put together in emailable form a collection of abstracts of some of the many papers spanning the last 25 years of study on the phenomenon of food and chemical hypersensitivity which I have emailed those who have written and asked for it. Those interested can contact me and I will send you what I have "transferred" from old fashioned hard copies to Word documents so far.A book on the subject from a renowned immunologist and allergist expert in this field can be read, and the reader can form her own conclusions:"FOOD ALLERGIES AND FOOD INTOLERANCE: THE COMPLETE GUIDE TO THEIR IDENTIFICTION AND TREATMENT", Professor Jonathan Brostoff , M.D.. Allergy, Immunology and Environmental Medicine, Kings' College, Londonhttp://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/089...r=2-1/102-64875 08-3420903[/URL]The autheor, Professor Brostoff, and a staff of other physicians are in the final editing of a new medical text for physicians on the subject as well, which should be published in 2003. The first edition "food Allergy and Intolerance" has been out of print for sometime. The new edition will provide some much needed guidance to the medical profession itself on the subject matter.This book may help further with patients suffering IBS and trying to get a handle on all aspects of symptom generation inlcuidng diet:IBS: A DOCTORS PLAN FOR CHRONIC DIGESTIVE TROUBLESBy Gerard Guillory, M.D.; Vanessa Ameen, M.D.; Paul Donovan, M.D.; Jack Martin, Ph.D. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/search-h...9085785-1742301 If you wish to read about the LEAP Disease Management Program and some peoples experiences with it, the following threads are recommendedLEAP and BLOOD TESTS http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=4;t=000285 WHAT IS LEAP? http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=4;t=000287 LEAP PT UPDATES http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=4;t=000286 "...THE LEAP THREADS BEING MOVED..." http://www.ibsgroup.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php...ic;f=4;t=000292 _______________________________________"Mike has just indicated that there is no funding available to begin addressing it." _______________________________________This is not what Mike said at all. Nor did Mike ever suggest anything realtive to this as an issue: _________________________________________"You can publish in the medical lit and not void out your patent rights." _________________________________________In fact the patented technolgy description was published directly to our peers, the laboratory professionals, three different times. One has othing to do with the other vis a vis new technology and limited publication....the real world issues must be addressed, those which are not experienced in the halls of academe.Mike said that the information published so far on this new technology consists of (3) articles in the American Clinical Laboratory Journals (reprints are available on request), an independednt study by a group of physicians in Europe, published in a european Allergy Journal, which demonstrates that the MRT test performed as claimed in their opinion, (reprints available on request), and that so far the first third party funding made available for studying MRT and LEAP Disease Mangement came from an AUTISM group, the Texas Center for Autistic Research and Treatment. The results of this study, in this application, must be positive since the Center is now using LEAP on their own private patients.I said that so far there have been no parties interested, private or public, in providing the large sum needed to implement a study protocol by a third party, even though one has been selected which is a well respected center for investigative studies. Not only does this center have extensive experience in FDA drug trials but their practive division (private patients) have used LEAP for IBS with success, in spite of the fact that the funding for the study is not forthcoming from any source. They are actually using it themselves based on the observed clinical outcomes on theor private patients with IBS-d...these investigators, WHO MAKE THEIR LIVING DOING PRECLINICAL TRIALS FOR DRUG COMPANIES INCLUDING IBS DRUGS.Mike said this kind of investigation does not yield such things as specifically a marketable drug in the end game, so the funding is exceedingly difficult to locate...not given up but sometimes you just have to find a way to do it yourself then. Therefore, if anything is to be done further as far as IBS goes, since this is a non-pharmacotherapy alternative and the private nor public sector have an interest in supporting it, the company will have to accumulate the money itself from operations. The daunting size of the number suggests it will take a bit to accumulate that amount of money. But it will be done. In the meantime anyone considering a Disease Mangement approach like LEAP should read all the available information published on the role of non IgE mediated hypersensitivity reactions in symptom generation, including an actual BOOK on the subject, consider the physician and dietician base using the method, talk with patients who have been through said protocols, consider the fact that over 270 insurance plans so far pay for it.Most of these plans have not, as has been suggested, done so solely to appease patients needs for alternative therapies. BUT many times as a result of MEDICAL NECESSITY REVIEWS of the IBS patients case, the technical papers on the test, the reports from physicians who have tried it so far and their outcomes, etc...what documentation is requested varies with the Plan Med Nec Review procedures. They have consistently deemed it approrpiate for reimbursement as the material presented was sufficient to meet their burden of proof of efficacy. It also seems to those involved that it makes sense to determine if the patients symptoms are being precipitated by non-allergic food or chemical hypersensitivity as if this can be isolated and removed, the symptoms should be reduced as will then the cost of ongoing care.Newness does not warant effectiveness, nor conversely does it imply a lack of efficicy. It simply means that the rules of "new" apply as they do to all new technologies, modalities, and protocols. The longer they are on the market the more information amasses. So each person has to decide on their own at what point sufficient info has amassed to satisfy them.Many physicians, dieticians and third party payers who have assessed the PROGRAM so far have decided that the existing information meets their burden of proof sufficient to allow their patients to access it and benefit from it. Also, much of the information available on IBS must be considered in the context of both the source and the fact that no one physician or group knows all that there is to know about IBS disease managment and physiology. All the info from many sources needs to be integrated by the medical community itself, and so far this has not occurred.Eat well. Think well. be well.MNL


----------



## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Can you post the full references to the papers?I can't seem to find them easily on Medline.K.


----------



## flux (Dec 13, 1998)

I've re-expressed Mike's post in depth below







And my post is just over an inch high.


----------



## Julia37 (May 9, 2001)

Well, I want to add my 2 cents here. Drs. with Barrett's and flux's attitude allowed me to be sick for 29 years from undiagnosed soy allergy. I am one of the people mentioned in Mr. Goldberg's rebuttal of "quackwatch" who got less than nothing from conventional doctors. I'm glad he did it, because I would have lost my temper and become incoherent if I tried to do it!My so-called doctors had no trouble overmedicating me, several times making me so ill I had to stay in bed, and my heart pounding so I thought I'd have a heart attack. It was especially frightening when I told a doctor of this reaction and she said casually, "oh, try taking a half dose". She didn't notice or care that I could have died from continuing to take that medicine!







It's sad that the medical establishment and food and chemical industries are so desperate, not to mention completeley self-centered, that they have to resort to such low activities as "quackwatch". Wouldn't it be easier for them to change their procedures to make them healthier?? If these doctors were really interested in helping their patients, they would keep an open mind to new information and treatments of chronic illnesses. As a person with a technical background I understand, and everyone should understand, that the information on the LEAP website is designed to make the concept of the test clear to non-techies. It's a fairly simple concept. The size of the white blood cells is measured, then the blood is challenged with a pure food (or common chemical additive). If the white cells shrink they're degranulating, a positive reaction. I'm sure there's plenty of more technical information that Signet could provide to anyone who is interested. As someone already pointed out, it's a blood test, there's nothing vague or "alternative" about it, except that it's new and it often takes the medical establishment 10 years or more to accept anything new - while people continue to suffer.Also I'd like to add that Mike helped me manage my allergies and food intolerances here on the board, and taught me about the technical aspects and mechanism of it, all without ever suggesting that I should pay him or take the LEAP test. If LEAP was trying to take advantage of suffering people, he would never have done that. As a food sensitivity sufferer himself, he wants to help others end their suffering, and so do I. I can't wait till everyone in the country knows about food sensitivity, and all sufferers have been diagnosed. If we have our way, that will be in a few years. If flux, Barrett, drug companies, food processors and certain doctors have their way, it will be never. They don't care how many people suffer as long as they continue to get rich.


----------



## WashoeLisa (Sep 12, 2000)

Thanks, Mike and Julia.Lisa from Nevada


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

Julia and Lisa







Isnt this a trip







Have you ever in your life seen anything like this.







..Just wanted to let you know that I am working on a positive project..My first big one ...I am a member of CVS and have been for along time and they know all about my results with LEAP and I had two mother of children with CVS to email me about all the detail....the food intolerance can trigger it and yes it is referenced..before other say it isntMike glad you are home safe with your family..and little Stephanie..They are lucky to have a caring person like you..FluxWhat is your degree in







witchdoctor!!or Gas Intolerance...


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

It is good to have another viewpoint on Quack Watch since it is used so often on this BB. People will be better able to make up their own minds about the things quackwatch refers to. I am not saying one way or another about what I conclude









> quote:"RECENTLY FOOD INTOLERANCE WAS FOUND TO BE RESPONSIBLE FOR SYMPTOMS OF SOME PATIENTS WITH THE IRRITABLE BOWEL SYNDROME, CONFIRMED BY * DOUBLE-BLIND * FOOD CHALLENGE.AN INCREASE IN RECTAL PROSTAGLANDIN LEVELS WAS NOTED WHEN A REACTION OCCURRED


I would love to know more details of this study given that I was reaching the point of believing that intolerance fails the double blind test with all the studies I have seen over a year. Is this study in anyway connected to Leap?


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

It is intriguing that, in making this cincession to reality in the most recent editions of the Merck Manual, that the studies refrred to are actually quite old. I will try to find them in my files when I get a chance. The first studies of this type checking for prostaglandins as markers of proinflammatory response to dietary componenets in patients where focused on d-types and are at least 10 years or more old.This is a reflection of the degree of cuation exercised before entering something into the manual of diagnosis, as well as a reflection of the equivocal nature of defining just what exactly IBS is.If you take a symptom based approach, then a wide range of possible etiologies can fall into the diagnosis. This is part of the basis for confusion.If however a causal approach is adhered to, then each time a CAUSE, a mechanism, of symptom generation is identified which presents as IBS, then that patient is "assigned" that diagnostic code, then the population of thos with IBS would shrink by elimination.OR if the medical establishiment should somday come to an actual concensus of "this etiology of these symptoms is what we will call IBS", then the same thing will occur from the top down rather than elimination.As fopr the studies referenced, the relationship is simply the same as all the wother work done over the last 25 years which has proved that in some people, a loss of oral toelrance to some foods or chemicals in fodds occurs, and there can be several reasons for it, and several different mechanisms can be involved that are non IgE (non food allergy) related.The LEAP Disease Managment protocol uses tools, both a novel in vitro assay and careful dietary intake analysis, and stresa dna nxiety reduction therpy where indicated, to carefully isolate what foods do NOTY provoke the symptoms commonly diagnosed as IBS, and change the patients lifestyle to one which avoids those things which provoke symptoms.That is the purpsoe of DM progrma, be it IBS or Diabetes or Wound Care whatever....isolate what precipitates the problem and remove it.Since the original PGE2 studies were done, much more data exists which confirms the involvement of both mucosal and cirsulating immunocytes in symptom generation.WHY remains the matter of debate, and a matter which is basically involving multiple possible etiologies.This article explains a portion of it, as it was witten before some recent work showing T Cell invovement as well as mast cell involvement. It hjas a diagram which shows the interraction between the systems in producing loss of oral tolerance.Alimentary Pharmacology and Therapeutics Vol. 15 Issue 4 Page 439 April 2001 Food hypersensitivity and irritable bowel syndrome S. Zar, D. Kumar, M. J. Benson http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/servlet/u...36.2001.00951.x MNL


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

KMI have a bunch of the various "food and chemical sensitivity abstracts" stored as word documents...so to post either them or the titles would require a very large amount of work stripping out the titles or URLS for them on PUBMED and I jjst don't have the free time to eprform the labor. BUT if you like I can email them to you as an attachment. You can persue them at your leisure then as you wish. It would be I think a large attachement list so one would want to check their email box first to make sure there is sufficient space. I am not a tekkie so I don't know how big the file size would be but imagine maybe 100 one page abstracts or simething...how big is that? When I have sent them to people before onmce or twcie it was kicked back for insufficient space. Anyway let me know if you want them ...posting them is not practical I think.MNLPSLOL, Maurice.







The more things change the more they stay the same eh?MNoLettuce, please.


----------



## WashoeLisa (Sep 12, 2000)

Hi Donna,Yes, this is what I was talking about before. When I was asked to come here and give my story as a patient ("We just want to TALK to a REAL patient and see what LEAP is like..."), I was pretty much dragged through the mud. Not a fun thing, I can tell you.I stayed away for a long time, as I do not need that kind of thing in my life. Having been sick for so long, I didn't want or need that kind of negativity. After coming back this time, I thought it was a nicer BB, but I see that, really, its not.One would think that after being so physically ill and riding that medical merry go round that all of us have, that the people here would be nicer to each other. Why add emotional pain to a group of people already in physical pain? I know I am a very different personality type (ENFP for you interested in the old Meyers-Briggs test)- but this seems that it should be obvious to everyone!Anyway,Donna, I am so happy for you that you are finally healthy! AND I am thrilled that I was able to help you in that!














MikeNL,you are the BEST that you can perservere and explain the same things over and over. I KNOW how busy you are and being a dad with a young child is also very time consuming (in a good way!)- but still you take time here to try and show people that there something "out there" that can help them. People seem to forget that you were the "first patient", so to speak, in this and THAT'S why you got involved too. To quote a commercial, "Not only are you the president of the company, you are also a patient".







Lisa from Nevada


----------



## Julia37 (May 9, 2001)

Mike,You can compress your collection of abstracts in a Zip file. It's a very simple program, if it's not already on your desktop I'm sure your techies can install it for you. If not let me know and I'll find out where you can get it on the web.You open it and use the Add button to insert the file, then save it as a .zip file. It takes up less space to e-mail, and the recipient can open it the same way and extract the file. You might want to make sure the recipient has Zip, but if not he or she can also get it easily.It's also excellent for presentations and such.


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

I agree with the person who said Mike is great at persevering and explaining things over and over







. MikeNL, if it is too much trouble don't bother finding that study. Maybe one day if you come across it you can e-mail it to me. But then again, you might not remember which of your zillion contacts wanted it







Maybe the study is this one?Food intolerance, prostaglandins, and irritable bowel syndrome. Author:Rampton DS, McNeil NI, Sarner M., Volume:1 Issue:8316, Page:123-4 Year:1983 Jan 15 .Source:Lancet, ID:6129434 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINEI have no access to a library as I am traveling (in India) so can't verify it


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

LisaIt was your story that changed my life...and I thank you for sharing that with me and other..In my wildest dreams I never thought I would find any kind of relief from IBS-D and CVS...Dont ever let anyone tell you that you havent made a difference in anyones life because you have...I have been able to live a life today that others probably sometimes take for granted...The simple little pleasures in life today has so many meanings to me...It was so bad for me that I couldnt enjoy anything because of the fear I had about IBS...My family is so happy for me and I am sure all my pets are too...My animals always knew when I was sick and laying on the couch curled up with my stomach hurting..because they always gave me the unconditional love even at my worst...I thank you again for hanging in here and sharing with me and others


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

Outta time to participate today, but what I took the time to add to this thread vis a vis questions about how we spend our so called "money" on studies or not might be of interest to some, and perhaps not, but if that question persists on this thread one may wish to go here and continue the dialogue there: http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=4&t=000293&p= MNLPSBONNIE...oh no its not trouble, the question is figuriong out which they are referring to as the PGE2 studies are quite a bit older and there is more compelling stuff since...and the primary PGE2 study I think I only have on hard copy not in Word. But I will indeed find time to do this for you, just need to give me a day or two as it is kinda busy for me right now. when you leave the office for 10 days it is amzing what piles up!ThanksMNLMH


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

Thanks Mike







. Please take your time over it. I can understand you have a lot of catching up to do after being out of your office for so many days.


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

BonnieiBe careful over in India...







I believe they are asking Americans to leave over there now..


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

Thanks ohnometo for your concern. I am in a bit of a quandary about it. Most Indians feel there is not going to be a war. I am going to play it by ear for a week before I decide. I am visiting my old mother because she is all alone and I don't want to cut my visit short


----------



## gfinster (Jan 11, 2001)

Are you injecting actual chemicals used in the food industry into the blood sample and measuring cell size pre and post injection? Do you obtain through this blood test quatifiable, scientifically repeatable results that can be crossed check against other tests? In other words would this blood test consistently identify and verify allergens that were identified through the traditional prick test?As far as being a mean bb I have to disagree. This is an open forum for free discussion about health issues related to IBS. I think this is good support for those of us suffering with illness and trying to deal with the medical community for drugs, diagnosis and support. I think this is "healthy" discussions that we need to have about our own health. When people are sick everyone has something to sell you. The drug companies and yes MikeNM. Look at the quality and quantity of life that has improved for aids patients thanks to the drug companies. I'm sure a good deal of the research was inspired and supported by those dying of the disease. We all benefit from their struggles. We with IBS will benefit from the struggles of those trying to find solutions as well. But, those solutions must be tested and proven beyond personal testimony for them to be available to the mass population of the suffering. Traditional medicine has given life and quality of life to all of us in some fashion or another. It doesn't have all the answers, it makes mistakes and is often blind in one eye. But you don't throw out baby with the bath water. If the MRT test is breakthrough and can be supported by traditional lab techs and procedures, then let's get it out there. I'll line up to help the cause! The point of medicine is to help those who are suffering. Most of us who are suffering are relying on traditional medicine (insurance being a large part of that). A true altruist would want a health solution to be available to all who suffer not just those that have spurned traditional medicine.I want to find out what is making me sick and avoid it like the plague. A traditional allergist has helped me determine that I'm allergic to soy, peanut and coconut which is in just about everything processed. I have greatly improved by eliminating these things. But, I don't want to eliminate things from my diet that I need, and want, if it is not necessary. It has been easy to eliminate soy since I observed the big whelp that came up on my back and arm when pricked with it. I had visible proof it is making me sick. I have verified it by being off of it and then eating it and have my very familiar IBS problems return. I'm not totally free of symptoms and suspect other sensitivities. Does this test provide proof that other chemicals and foods are making me sick? Proof meaning definable, repeatable, verifiable, results obtained by using traditionally accepted lab procedures. Thanks for your stories and I'm glad you are all doing well since going on the leap program. It helps to hear how you have dealt with and been successful with your IBS. Please respect others need for more information in our quest to cope.


----------



## WashoeLisa (Sep 12, 2000)

Bonnie,Best wishes for your safety.... Hope you enjoy your visit with your mom. That is definitely one you don't want to cut short if you can help it.Donna,Thank you so much! What amazed me more than anything when I came here is that I was just trying to pass on the gift of health that was given to me- and I was being treated like the worst scum of the earth.It says more about them than anything else though.I am so very happy for you!







Yes, my family was so happy to have me back too!Big hugs,Lisa from NEvada


----------



## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Just looking for the MRT references


> quote: Mike said that the information published so far on this new technology consists of (3) articles in the American Clinical Laboratory Journals (reprints are available on request), an independednt study by a group of physicians in Europe, published in a european Allergy Journal, which demonstrates that the MRT test performed as claimed in their opinion, (reprints available on request),


This made it sound like there were a couple of specific articles....I don't really have the time or energy to sort through dozens of pages of abstracts just looking for these specific articles right now.Allergy shots (I think) are creating a great deal of havoc with energy levels and I can barely slog through what I have to do much less sort through a long series of abstracts to see which if any have to do specifically with the MRT test.How about just the authors and the years for the journal articles listed. Doesn't have to be the whole title. Author and year should bring up those articles in a Medline search "mediator release test" doesn't seem to pull up much of anything, and "mediator release" is way too general to be useful.K.


----------



## WashoeLisa (Sep 12, 2000)

gfinster,What can I say? I AM an IBS patient too- one of those ones whom everyone is trying to sell something to- just like YOU.I get awfully tired of defending myself- and if you go back into the archives and read the things that were said to me and about me, you'll see what I mean about this being a not so nice BB. I was ASKED to come here to answer questions as a real life LEAP patient and I was literally attacked by many, many members here.Read some of the other posts that MikeNL has placed in the other LEAP thread and you can read about the science behind it. LEAP also has a much lower level of false negatives and positives than the skin prick test, by the way. So just because you can SEE it, doesn't mean much sometimes. Also, LEAP tests a different immunological phenomenon than the skin prick tests.Sorry if it seems that I am down on you. I am more than happy to answer questions on a personal level, from a patient's perspective...Lisa from Nevada


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

Thanks, Washoe Lisa.


> quote:The LEAP Disease Managment protocol uses tools, both a novel in vitro assay and careful dietary intake analysis, and stresa dna nxiety reduction therpy where indicated, to carefully isolate what foods do NOTY provoke the symptoms commonly diagnosed as IBS, and change the patients lifestyle to one which avoids those things which provoke symptoms.


Does that mean it doesn't use double blind food tests/challenges at any stage of the game?


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

KM: _____________________________________"This made it sound like there were a couple of specific articles....I don't really have the time or energy to sort through dozens of pages of abstracts just looking for these specific articles right now." _______________________________________No need. I'll send you the reprints if you like.On the other stuff, I will see if over the weekend I could find time to pick through the array of abstracts and compile something. Lke you, I am very pressed for time as well. But I will make an effort to try to find a quickie way of giving some of the references. The reprints from Clinical Lab showing the new technology and intitial results are on hard copy only.MNL


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

BONNIE: _________________________________________"Does that mean it doesn't use double blind food tests/challenges at any stage of the game? " __________________________________________No, not as part of the dietary protocol. Double blind oral challenge in cases of non IgE mediated hypersensitivity reactosn to foods is literally impossible to do as you cannot get the provoking dose into the patients with capsules usually, and using carrier foods adds the variables of the fact that a large amount of the carrier must be sued to mask the challenge food relative to it, so large maounts must be ingested. The best carrier is lentil puree, but it is full of lectin so then if you get a reaction the added variable is whether it is the challenge food or the large amount of lectin in the lentils which can cause direct degranulation of mast cells in the gut (pseudoallergy).So over the years and after thousands of trilas a specific elimination-reintorduction protolc was develped, using the test and history and intake logs as a starting point, followed by phased reintroduction by open challenge. Clinically it works, producing good outcomes and uncovering hidden pseudoallergy which cannot be detected by any in vitro assay as well as any large dose sensitivitieis which might fall outside the titration range of the in vitro assay.The patient ends up with a very patient specific diet which minimzes symptoms maximally and is as wide and varied as is possible for that patient.Brostoff can explain the blind oral challenge problem compared to how easy it is for allergy. "FOOD ALLERGIES AND FOOD INTOLERANCE: THE COMPLETE GUIDE TO THEIR IDENTIFICTION AND TREATMENT", Professor Jonathan Brostoff , M.D.. Allergy, Immunology and Environmental Medicine, Kings' College, London http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/089...6487508-3420903 This is why Professor Bengtsson developed the jejunal isolationm method in 1994....but I think LEAP patients do not ant to have to slip a 7 lumen catheter into their small bowel every week for the blind challenges to be conducted... LOLMNL


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

Just wanted to share this thread with anyone interested...Now for those who think LEAP is out to make money...read this...He took it upon his self to test me for free...Thanks for taking that chance with me Mike...and it worked for my IBS-D and CVSMike NoLomotil Senior Member Member # 3101 posted 10-27-2001 01:09 PM --------------------------------------------------------------------------------OHYESYOUTOO:I have read everything you wrote very closely, and while I could go item by item and discuss each with you, we will run out of bandwidth.First, based on my years of watching all manner of approaches to your symptoms, everyone who has done what they did to you did so to the best that they know how to do. There is nothing I would try to armchair-quarterback about with any practitioner who has seen you as each thing has been done based upon your presentation.That being said Dr. Schuster is the closest one yet to the underlying MECHANISM that is practically shouting that it is at work here. Cyclic Vomiting Syndrome, a very rare disorder which usually appears in kids and then many times morphs into migraine as they get older. This is a damn good deductive theory, simply because we can demonstrate that Cyclic Vomiting Syndrome is a case of major dysfunction of the small bowel immunoendoneural system which is being provoked by chemicals either naturally occuriign in the foods the kid eats or additives to the foods.But it is not an allergy reaction so they test negative for food allergy. They test positive on the testing the immunologists I work with use, and when you remove the test positive chemicals, or foods that carry them, (or it is a protein in the food itself sonmetimes) the kids symptoms disappear.3 years ago I heard about a boy in Boca Raton with CVS and we had our dieticians work him up, test him, and give his parents a diet to follow. His symptoms subsided within a month. When he cheated on the diet they came back. Case closed.You have symptoms that look similar to CVS to Dr. Schuster but they are puzzling. Dr. Bengtsson in Sweden (Sahlgrens Medical University hospital) recently confirmed, by isolating the jejunum and then analyzing various things like fluid and tissue, in patients with confirmed food intolerance absent allergy who presented with these IBS diarrheaic type symptoms, mild to severe, including the systemic symptoms, that the small bowel fluid and tissue is full of the proinflammtory mediators that are released from both bowel and circulating immune cells when presented with a seriously bad pathogen.You look like a textbook non-IgE mediated but mast-cell predominant "loss of oral tolerance" case. It starts there (small bowel mast cells) and then spreads to the lymphocytes in the bowel wall, then the granulocytes circulating then the platelets too and before you know it not only is the gut exploding with d, and pain, but all the sysmptoms of flushing (vessel dilation) dizziness, nausea, vomiting, even ringing ears, disorientation....it is like a massive case of food poisoning or severe food allergy but there is no allergy detetced (your SPT are negative which is consistent...this is the most false-positives possible...and Bengstsson ahs shown that you get these symptoms and the mediators released WITHOUT SPECIFIC IGE TO THE FOOD> You would probably be RAST negative too....maybe an IgG subclass positive as that is one of the mechanisms possible.Bottom line they are going nuts becasue they do not the means of isolating what is provoking the reactions. They do not have test for it. And it is some things you are eating regularly because you said your "white cell count" is elevated but no infection.This is a result of certin proinflamatory mediators which stimulate certain kinds of leukocyte "recruitment" are being released constantly. But it can build and build slowly until the provocation reaches a mass-provocation level in the plasma and.or chyme and then the big episode comes. And it seems to have no pattern as it is delayed, and dose-dependent, the two things that food allergies are NOT.I lived like this for 30 years. Since I worked in the hospital it was concvenient, or I just toughed it out on the bathroom floor with 2 packs of cigarettes for 18 hours at a time. I do not anymore.The low grade fever is also consistent, as chemicals called endogenous pyrogens are among the inflammatory mediators involved.I could go on but, unless someone has missed a serious parasite infection which can also present something like this (and with all the testing you have had this is unlikely) there are things unknown (chemicals to elemental foods) provoking these severe immunologic reactions starting down in the small bowel. Thats why they are elusive. You have to either do what Bengtsson et al did/do and go into the small bowel and provoke it directly then analyze the tissue and fluids, or you have to use the in vitro technology developed by the immunologists I work, some of whom are european and collaborate with Bengtsson.I have to go now...babaysitting time....but I am going to do something that is only reserved for really really rough cases...and I do not hink I ever did this before in this commuity, but lets not beat around the bush.I want you to go to our website today, fill out the Symptom prescreening form and email it in for me to look at tomorrow.If it comes out the way I beleive it will I want to send you a test kit and test you for free. But I want to send the test results to you and to your doctor...and you have to promise to follow the protocol we give you. if you don't I will throw your blood in the garden I think we can reduce these symptoms with some dietary controls specific to you, and I have several new things our doctors are looking at, non-drug, which can stabilize the immunocytes.There is also a specific drug prep your dr. can try off-label (it is normally used for IBD and it is only temporary in effectiveness) but if you respond to it, it might help a little temporarily while the prophylaxis program gets sorted out.THis can be managed as all the hard work has eben done...everything else keeps coming up either negative or unexplaianbly weird. You fit the picture. ME too.Also If you want to learn about what I am going to talk to you about [if yo want to do this I am talking about] get this book right away...there is material in it I will want to refer you to.ï¿½FOOD ALLERGIES AND FOOD INTOLERANCE: THE COMPLETE GUIDE TO THEIR IDENTIFICTION AND TREATMENTï¿½, Professor Jonathan Brostoff (M.D.. Allergy, Immunology and Environmental Medicine, Kingsï¿½ College, London) http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/089...6487508-3420903 Professor Brostoff is our chief consulting immunologist, alergist, pathologist and enviornmental medicien specialist. If need be we can run your case past him too for any other ideas. I can usualy sneak one or two in a month on him Again, I could be wrong but I have lived this and seen it so many times [YOU ARE NOT ALONE!! BELEIVE ME] it makes my head hurt thinking about you. I feel very strongly, that Dr. S intuitively knows what is wrong based upon what he said, but he has not seen the new stuff available to root this out. I think we can help you and in so doing amybe help some others.By the way as an aside I am not discounting anything about the CNS anxiety and stress response role in this symptom set as it is a mandatory result of mast cell degranulation.....not only psychologically do the symptms get amplified but chemically. Some of these mediators go "into the brain" so to speak and affect the CNS and pripheral nervous syetm as well.Once it is triggered it is like a tornado...the cascade of events just keeps progressing until ou are in the ER looking like you are some poison shellfish or something but everything comes up saying NOT...but there you are...melting melting melting. Most people are amazed how much kless anxiety has to do with these kinds of symptoms once the reactions are stopped and the chemicals stop coursing through your veins.No way. I cannot let you go by with some "advice" or "read this". You are too sick and too "obvious".Please do that (fill out the form, I will ee it in the morning) and remember everything is confidential. As soon as you enter it your privacy is guaranteed by law. This will cost you nothing, even if the lab runs a full 150 sustance series...I want your case, though...You can be Madam ONO.Think it over.MNL________________www.leapallergy.com http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=1&t=024279&p= --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

This is just one of the results taken from my test ....and they told me everything was ok..These results are the same thing that the Dr Brostoff has seen when Food Intolerance plays a part in the illness....ohnometo Senior Member Member # 8229 posted 10-30-2001 11:11 AM --------------------------------------------------------------------------------After one of my many test If you saw this reading what would this mean to you? Just would like to get your opinion or any others. Just curious because it may not mean anything. After all I was told by the Dr's it wasnt no big deal....The Colonic biopsies reveal tiny fragments of mucosal tissue lined be straight tubular glands with goblet cells. The lamina propria is infiltrated be chronic inflammatory cells, mainly lymphocytes and plasma cells....Another one is : The biopsy is a tiny fragemnt of gastric mucosa, showing focal fibrosis and collections of chronic inflammatory cells, noted in the lamina propia. --------------------Donna http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...f=1&t=024362&p=


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

> quote:This is why Professor Bengtsson developed the jejunal isolationm method in 1994....but I think LEAP patients do not ant to have to slip a 7 lumen catheter into their small bowel every week for the blind challenges to be conducted... LOL


LOL. I didn't think of the practicality of the whole thing. That is why I am a mathematician and not a biologist, LOL. MikeNL, you will be delighted to learn that one of the first things I am going to do when I hit American soil is buy that book you keep recommending. It is high time I bought it instead of pestering you with questions. Thanks a lot for taking the time to answer my questions in such detail over the year that I have been on the board. The best part of it was I never had to wait for the answers. I knew you came on in the mornings and the answers were there in the mornings. Thanks.







Anyways onwards to the book


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

BonnieiI sure hope they never ask me to do that test







to prove anything....If so I want to be knocked out before, during, afterward...butif it showed that differnt things can provoke IBS symptoms I probably would...Mike, dont get any ideas


----------



## WashoeLisa (Sep 12, 2000)

Oh yeah, Donna!I'll go to bat anywhere for Signet and LEAP - after the the good they have done in giving me my life back.But jejeunal isolation studies? Nuh-uh. That is the limit for me. No way. No how.







Lisa from Nevada


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

Have no fear as we have to satnd by and wait for awhile then go back to Professor Bengtsson and see when he has caught up with his work and when we can get together on it. Somehow they must pay the patients enough, uh what would it be (currency), ?gilder?, to let them do these invasive studies...which from my perspective sound somewhat brutal, but I have sen referred to by other investigators as "elegant". Elegant! The scientific mind LOLMNLOHInteresteing stuff about that subject of publications and studies and what the real deal is wehn people make it sound like some easy thing is not being done by us....todays JAMA: __________________________________ http://wire.ap.org/APnews/?SITE=ILLIN&FRONTID=HOME JUNE 05, 01:37 ET AMA Journal Critiques Report Data By LINDSEY TANNER AP Medical Writer Excerpted:"CHICAGO (AP) - The Journal of the American Medical Association has put aside presenting medical advances this week to turn a critical eye on itself, finding imperfections in the way it and other medical journals report scientific research. JAMA's latest issue says journal studies are sometimes misleading and frequently fail to disclose weaknesses and disagreements among authors, while news releases some journals prepare often don't mention study limitations or industry funding. Some problems can be traced to biases and conflicts of interest among peer reviewers, who are outside scientists tapped by journal editors to help decide whether a research paper should be published, according to several of the JAMA articles. "and further on...."DeAngelis said problems are most likely to occur in research funded by drug companies, which have a vested interest in findings that make their products look good. Journal editors are concerned that manufacturers sometimes unduly influence how researchers report study results, and even suppress unfavorable findings. Many top journals require researchers to disclose any ties to drug companies, and Dr. Jeffrey Drazen, editor of the New England Journal of Medicine, said editors rely on researchers to be truthful. " ______________________________Click the link for a LITTLE peek into the realities of the big time peEr reviewed publication world, from the top.Eat well. Think well. Be well.MNL


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

Hmm...another intriguing revelation...they come in 3's so one still left to go today... _________________________________Excerped from http://wire.ap.org/APnews/?SITE=ILLIN&FRONTID=HOME JUNE 04, 18:38 ET Suit: Drug Maker Stifled Generics By ANDREW WELSH-HUGGINS Associated Press Writer COLUMBUS, Ohio (AP) - Bristol-Myers Squibb Co. was sued Tuesday by 29 states that said the drug maker acted illegally to maintain its monopoly on the cancer-fighting drug Taxol and keep cheaper generic versions off the market. The lawsuit alleges that Bristol-Myers fraudulently obtained patents that had no legal validity for Taxol, one of the most widely used treatments for breast and ovarian cancer. Etc.... __________________________________MNL


----------



## WashoeLisa (Sep 12, 2000)

Hi Mike,Yes- I read with interest the "revelations" in today's news...Paid for jejeunal isolation studies, huh? Well, maybe. If I could take my kids to WaltDisneyWorld on it again- then, sure! LOL







Lisa from Nevada


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

> quote: Click the link for a LITTLE peek into the realities of the big time peEr reviewed publication world, from the top


I am a day too late for the link. I would have liked to read the article. Sorry, Mike, one more question-Is there any other way of locating the article?


----------



## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Peer review is kinda like democracy(paraphrasing cant remember who did the original quote)It is a lousy system, but everything else is worse.The thing is I don't say it is always easy to get good science done and published, but I have personally seen and known people who have with a bit of effort gotten stuff published (including one of my advisors who sent his bacterial strains to an editor with a "fine you do the experiment and tell me what the answer is" note....two weeks later got an accepted for publication without a problem) I'm not saying it will necessarily be a walk in the park, but at least with peer-reviewed data there is some chance that the published stuff is of good quality AND the how's and why's and information needed for someone else to replicate it is out in public.I mean, really, some middle school kid got her study published in JAMA.......







http://www.cnn.com/2002/HEALTH/06/04/medic...s.ap/index.html Seems to be a still valid link to the story.One of the messages I read in it is how BAD a study can be done and still get published...not how hard it is to get something published, or do the studies.Generally when reading the medical lit you have to A) have an understanding of statisitcs good enough to catch the simple "how to lie with stastics" stuff and







look for replicated work.Anything fluky can happen once, or even in one study. When stuff is replicated by different laboratories then you start to get some idea of how good the info is.After all what is considered statistically different still has some low probabitity of having happened just by chance.The worst part of the medical lit is the stuff that gets sent out in press releases. (no peer review for those, unfortunately) Much of the time something that sounds really good on the CNN read of it when you look at the original paper it is obvious what holes are there.K.


----------



## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

see also http://jama.ama-assn.org/issues/current/ffull/jtw20017.html Don't know how much of the full text is open to public, but at least abstracts probably are.K.


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

It can be hard to get something published. My husband is an academic who publishes and he knows some of his papers have got rejected just because of his politics not matching those of the reviewers. There are alll these different factions even in academics with their own vested interests. BTW this is specially true as far as funding goes. Funding is never obtained solely on the basis of merit.Anyway I am really curious about the publishing world. It would have been good to see that article.


----------



## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

The CNN and JAMA linkes worked this morning...did you try them??Yep, politics can cause havoc, but good data does eventually get published even when it is politically incorrect (thus what my advisor had to do to get something published it was the exact opposite of what some bigger name than him published and getting that out was like pulling teeth).And many papers have to go to more than one publication to get published because of politics at one journal or another. I think Nature occasionally publishes lists of Hot Papers we didn't publish, but wish we did.It isn't like there is one single monolithic structure and X will never get published anywhere, or anyhow.But that which "bucks the system" will tend to have to be more solidly done that stuff that is politically convienient.K.


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

I just checked the articles out. thanks kmottus. I didn't check them out earlier because I wanted to see the AP article. I feel it does a better job of reporting than does CNN. THE JAMA site looks like a virtual goldmine.It will take me a while to go through all the abstracts and articles and unfortunately I don't have that kind of time right now. Skimmed it briefly and I agree with the study which says open peer review is the way to go as it holds the reviewers more accountable .Don't know much about the legal consequences which might follow.


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

Comments...sorry no timer to come out and play lately ___________________________________Sorry Mike, one more question-Is there any other way of locating the article? ____________________________________Without checking out what K posted I am sure she gave you the answer..one sometimes strectehs the limits of copyright with our postings but one becomes hesitant to post an entire article from JAMA as the rule of bigger generally translates to bigger "bat" to hit you with,. hence links not text. ____________________________________"I mean, really, some middle school kid got her study published in JAMA......." ____________________________________and ____________________________________"One of the messages I read in it is how BAD a study can be done and still get published...not how hard it is to get something published, or do the studies." ____________________________________Let me just comment together as my time is limited these days by new thigs and increased intensity of activity...lucky for all of you







Absolute living proof of the frequent biases associated with getting something into print. Swamped with submissions, selection is often not on the basis of clinical relevance or even the specific prescribed standards for publication, but on hidden agenda. This happens with regularity, fact, not fiction, fact. Sux and needs to change and not supposed to talk about it but fact.This is the point of how hard it is to get published and that message could indeed be said to not be there if you do not take into full account and context the carefully stated self criticisms referencing biases of review borad memebers being on the payorlls of industry of all kinds, not just drug industry, as this is where the biggest barrier comes. It is like that old "glass ceiling" reference to the inablity of women to rise in manageent due to gender bias.It exists. it is real. Quid pro quo rules now even more than when I was on the side of the fence when I was with the universities and medical centers where the grease was liberally applied, or consulted with the development departments of industries doing the greasing. Nobody would ever beleive it until they have lived it...and often do not want reality to sully the pristine assumptions of the healthcare receiver...the patient...the public.Having been on both sides of the table for many years, I can only confirm without hesitation that the system is biased towards the halls of academe and related medical centers and those within him who are bankrolled by the various elements of the healthcare industry. Such ahs it alwasy been for the 30+ years I have been in the biz and such shall it be until some better system comes along, or the system is reformed. Not likley as the strength of our economic concept is its weakness as wel...the dollar drives the machine.That being said I do agree that it is the BEST SYSTEM by design, it is that the IMPLEMENTATION of the system is so often biased in the selection process that much good work is relegated to one of a thousand presentations at medical conference which merely end up in the conference presentations handout or CD. That work often takes years to break the publication barrier when it could have been clinically helpful if it had been seen outside the purgatory of the room with 50 sleepy attendees.When I worked for the Cleveland Clinic, did consulting, investigation and design work for Chemetron/NCG, Elema Schonander, Mt. Sinai Medical Center...etc I am not going to namke them all lest some example of an action which once occurred be construed to be libelous towarsd some institution, and the medical universities and the hospitals with prestige, ANYTHING that was written, investigated, even peeked at and even so much as a minimalist case report prepared, no matter how selective the data we included, flew onto the pages of the journals with shocking regularity and was met with awe and reverance. Let me stop there before I enter into the toally dark and forbidden world of "if you beat on the data hard enough it wikl say whatever you want" and "mistakes are not published they are butied".Once entering the private sector, the contrast in attitude and screening standards applied to any work of any kind was so stark as to be incomprehensible at first. I was at first aghast! But I was a young man and did not understand "the game" yet. I had to live it to learn it and those who yell the loudest that it does not exist are often those who are tied the tightest to that part of it that is denounced as fictional.To really live it one has to have lived it from both sides. It is easier to visualize when you have the personal experience, than when you have only experienced one position at the table or the other.When one lives in a mansion one of necessity and naturally has a certain perspective from that vantage point and personal experience. When one lives in the kibbutz, one by nature has a different view, experience and perspective. Switch plcaes Live in them both and this little light goes on for both people "Ahh, NOW I see what he.she was talking about!"Eat well, Think well, Be well.MNL


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

!! Just came in the morning mail...do not know if Doc name is "released" yet so deleted until confirmation of release.....More quackery: _____________________________________May 29, 2002To whom It May Concern,R.M. is a middle aged white female whom I have been seeing for approximately one year. She suffers from Cyclic Vomiting Syndrome, which is only recently recognized in adults and is known to be a migraine variant affecting the GI tract.It is a syndrome characterized by intermittent profuse vomiting , usually associated with severe pain. R.M. has had a particularly severe case and has been evaluated at multiple medical centers including university medical centers such as the Mayo Clinic.We conducted LEAP testing on the patient and after counseling and adherance to diet, she has set a new record by going as long as 7 weeks and counting without narcotic injection for pain and symptom control. She and I have both been very impressed with the success, not only of this patient but others, and she is, for obvious reasons, highly motivated to remain compliant.Sincerely,X.XXXX XXXXXX, M.D. (letter on file) _____________________________________Hey Donna, see this???? You have more company...







MNL


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

Mike I am really working with CVS and I also got alot of information in the mail yesterday and I want to make copies and send them to you..It is from Debra Waites...The founder of CVS website..I have been talking to a few people and they seemed very interested in me and how much better I have become...That lady has 7 weeks and I have 7 months...U N B E L I V E A B L E


----------



## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Yeah the system is political and that can mean you have to shop a paper around before you find a place for it...But I still have seen that GOOD DATA eventually wins out over politics. Which is what I don't think you even want to acknowledge. So many examples of political land mines that did get through the system by having REALLY good data with experimental designs that were solid. YES if it is with the conventional wisdom bad papers get published sometimes more easily because they take less effort, but that doesn't mean that GOOD DATA that is politically incorrect cannot willnot, never ever get published.Else the discoverer of prions would have NEVER gotten published or the Nobel Prize. The discoverer of transposons would have NEVER gotten published or won the Nobel Prize. Heck there are some who still have political objections to prions even with the whole Mad Cow thing and the winning of the Nobel Prize. Stuff that bucks the "conventional wisdom politically correct science" can get in the journals, but it does take some extra effort.Just because it is a political system (like every human endevour ends up being) doesn't mean that X can never ever be published anywhere at any time (which kinda sounds like the arguement you are trying to make, our stuff is politically bad and wrong so no one will ever let it past review or publish it....).It just means that X has to be done really well and it may take more time and effort to find it a home (some journals are much tougher than others to get in, and some like Nature occasionally really LIKE to publish controversial papers that no one else would touch...so it really varies across the board as to how the politics plays out. I mean Nature published the Benviniste stuff that most journals would have never touched, now they did add their own investigation of the research and published that, but they did buck the political trend and put it in the journal).K.


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

ANNOUNCEMENT!!!Ilena Rosenthal VINDICATED!!! Court throws out Quackbuster lawsuitJUDGE THROWS OUT BARRETT LAWSUIT AGAINST ILENA ROSENTHALIn yet ANOTHER major development and Quackbuster DEFEAT, Oakland Superior Court Judge James A. Richman ordered that the lawsuit filed by Quackbusters STEPHEN J. BARRETT, M.D., TERRY POLEVOY M.D. and attorney CHRISTOPHER E. GRELL be thrown out.This is a stunning, but not surprising, new development and defeat for the Quackbusters. Judge Richman also ordered that Barrett, Polevoy and attorney Christopher Grell pay for ILENA ROSENTHAL's attorney's fees and costs in bringing her motion.In his ruling Judge Richman found that Grell had no evidence of wrongdoing on the part of Rosenthal and that Barrett and Polevoy lacked prerequisite evidence. The motion brought by Ms. Rosenthal was based on recently enacted California SLAPP (Strategic Lawsuits Against Public Participation) statute, which seeks to prevent lawsuits that are "brought primarily to chill the valid exercise of the constitutional rights of free speech and petition for redress of grievances." Judge Richman found that the Barrett/Polevoy/Grell lawsuit was that type of lawsuit.Health Freedom Law applauds Ilena Rosenthal for her courage and determination and congratulates Attorney Mark Goldowitz of the CALIFORNIA ANTI_SLAPP PROJECT for his work in this case.This has been a great week for Health Freedom and a MAJOR blow to those that do not believe in free speech and an individualï¿½s right to have health choice. For FULL TEXT of ruling & more information go to http://www.healthfreedomlaw.com


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

Quackbusters" sued for ten million dollars Email from Tim Bolen of JuriMed July 25, 2001"Doctor No" BUSTED in California.. People magazine called him "Doctor No." Time Magazine called him "The Man Who Loves To Bust Quacks." Biography Magazine says he's here "to combat health-related frauds, myths, fads, and fallacies." Somebody in California didn't agree with that assessment. They called him something else entirely - and they said it with legal documents. In a California Court, Monday afternoon, July 23, 2001, in a ten million dollar lawsuit, Stephen Barrett MD (www.quackwatch.com) was charged with Racketeering (RICO), Violation of Civil Rights, Unlawful, Unfair, and Fraudulent Business Practices, Intentional Interference With Prospective Advantage, Negligent Interference With Business Advantage, Malicious Prosecution, Abuse of Process, Negligence, and Civil Conspiracy. They also asked the judge to issue orders shutting down Barrett's activities. All, for the activities Barrett loves to descibe on his own website. The legal action claims that the Stephen Barrett, and the other parties named, have engaged in Mail Fraud, Wire Fraud, Perjury, Subornation of Perjury, Extortion, Stalking, Terrorist threats, Assault, Filing false police reports, Illegal lobbying, Illegal influence of foreign government officials and/or agencies, Trespass, Invasion of Privacy, Web site tampering, Internet Spam, Investigation without license, Violation of Civil Rights & Free Speech, Interference with Right of Free Speech and Association.


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

and then...Today - the tables were turned... Some techniques he and his followers (known as "Quack Busters") have used over and over again against practitioners of alternative health methods, are lawsuits, and threats of lawsuits. Today, he and many of his group, have been named in a lawsuit filed by Health Freedom Law attorney Carlos F. Negrete, in California. It is Case # 833 021-5. Click for FULL TEXT to read the entire filing, or go to www.healthfreedomlaw.com to read it in its original form. The lawsuit charges Stephen Barrett, his wife Judith Barrett, Terry Polevoy (of Canada), Christopher Grell, Quackwatch Inc., Quackwatch.com, Lehigh Valley Committee Against Health Fraud, the National Council Against Health Fraud Inc., NCAHF, Healthwatchers.net, the Georgia Council Against Health Fraud, Rebecca Long, Rebekah Johnson, Scotsoft Research, ssr.com, hcrc.org, Aron Primack, Peter W. Pappas, Joseph Pizzorno, Robert S. Baratz MD, William T. Jarvis, Tim Gorski, John Stone, Bill Ross, Peter Bowditch, Monica Pignotti, Paul Lee, Michael McNeil, Paul Hilling, J.A. Lyons, Paul Smith, QUACKBUSTERSOFTHEILLUMUNATTI, Esther Figueroa, Jose Figueroa, and roes 1-500 inclusive, WITH: Unlawful, Unfair, and Fraudulent Business Practices (B & PC ï¿½ 17200 et seq ), Violation of Civil Rights, Intentional Interference With Prospective Advantage, Negligent Interference With Prospective Advantage, Civil Racketeering Influenced and Corrupt Organizations (RICO), Abuse of Process, Negligence, Civil Conspiracy, and a plea for Injunctive Relief. The legal action claims that Stephen Barrett, and the above mentioned parties have engaged in "Mail Fraud, Wire Fraud, Perjury, Subornation of Perjury, Extortion, Stalking, Terrorist threats, Assault, Filing false police reports, Illegal lobbying, Illegal influence of foreign government officials and/or agencies, Trespass, Invasion of Privacy, Web site tampering, Internet Spam, Investigation without license, Violation of Civil Rights & Free Speech, Interference with Right of Free Speech and Association." Barrett - who calls himself a "Consumer Advocate" has written many books on the subject of what he views as "Quackery". He has managed to get himself a lot of attention as a self-proclaimed "Expert" in Quackery and Health Fraud. Through his web-sites, his books and articles and testimony, he has attacked many forms of leading edge or alternative theories, including Chiropractic, Acupuncture, Homeopathy, dietary supplements, alternative approaches to cancer treatment, and others. The lawsuit was filed on behalf of New Century Press as a response to a lawsuit filed against it by Barrett, et al.


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

'Quack Buster' bustedFor years, Stephen Barrett, self-appointed "quack buster," has directed many of his most venomous attacks at chiropractic. He has used print and broadcast media -- as well as the Internet -- in an attempt to do what the American Medical Association failed to do during their anti-chiropractic campaign: destroy and contain chiropractic.When faced with criticism of his own closed- mindedness or vindictiveness, Barrett has had a reputation for threatening lawsuits to silence his detractors.However, in what's been called a landmark free speech decision, a judge in Northern California has thrown out a defamation lawsuit against a San Diego woman who called Barrett a "quack" on her own Internet discussion group.Alameda County Superior Court Judge James A. Richman has ordered Barrett to pay the woman's legal fees, stating, "Boundaries of permissible public discourse have evolved significantly in the last half-century."Barrett, a former psychiatrist who holds no current medical license, is one of the most vocal opponents of non-medical health care and his "Quackwatch" website, launched in 1996, is frequently cited in anti-chiropractic media reports.The defendant, Ilena Rosenthal, has a website that serves as a support group for women who have had problems with breast implants. In online discussions, she has called Barrett an arrogant quack, and stated that he was a "bully" who tried to "extort" her, and that "Quackwatch appears to be a power-hungry, misguided bunch of pseudoscientific socialistic bigots."Barrett tried to shut her up by slapping her with a lawsuit for defamation and libel, but the judge threw the case out since, he stated, Barrett was a public figure and the online discussion was protected by the Constitution's right to free speech.The ruling came on July 25, just two days after New Century Press filed a RICO (racketeering) lawsuit against Barrett and his fellow "Quackbusters."The lawsuit charges Stephen Barrett, his wife Judith Barrett, with "Unlawful, Unfair, and Fraudulent Business Practices ... Violation of Civil Rights, Intentional Interference With Prospective Advantage, Negligent Interference With Prospective Advantage, Civil Racketeering Influenced and Corrupt Organizations (RICO), Malicious Prosecution, Abuse of Process, Negligence, (and) Civil Conspiracy."Also named in the suit are many of Barrett's business enterprises and associates -- including Terry Polevoy (of Canada), Christopher Grell, Quackwatch Inc., Quackwatch.com, Lehigh Valley Committee Against Health Fraud, the National Council Against Health Fraud Inc., NCAHF, Healthwatchers.net, the Georgia Council Against Health Fraud, Rebecca Long, Rebekah Johnson, Scotsoft Research, ssr.com, hcrc.org, Aron Primack, Peter W. Pappas, Joseph Pizzorno, Robert S. Baratz M.D., William T. Jarvis, Tim Gorski, John Stone, Bill Ross, Peter Bowditch, Monica Pignotti, Paul Lee, Michael McNeil, Paul Hilling, J.A. Lyons, Paul Smith, QUACKBUSTERSOFTHEILLUMUNATTI, Esther Figueroa, Jose Figueroa, and others.The suit asserts that, "Without any basis or clinical research of their own, Dr. Barrett (a de-licensed psychiatrist) and Dr. Polevoy (an acne care physician), and each of the Cross-Defendants, have focused their unqualified attack on the scientific findings of Dr. Clark. Applying their obviously limited scientific understanding of microbiology and parasitology, they minimize the significance of Dr. Clark's work by addressing only one form of parasite that they believe is the entirety of her findings. It is almost as if they picked up one of Dr. Clark's books and read the middle page and nothing else, then decided they are experts in the field of parasitology."Dr. Clark's attorney's also noted, in the legal action, that Barrett and his cohorts "have used the internet as their national pulpit by which they preach the exclusive validity of allopathic medicine to their cult-like followers. Their dogmatic medical mantras are laced with character assassinations and demagoguery to advance their own personal agenda and those of other executioners for traditional medicine."In a statement applauded by alternative health care advocates around the world, the Health Freedom Legal Defense Council, which represents Clark, explained the reason for their lawsuit: "Recently, countless supporters of Dr. Clark became fed up with the ongoing flood of internet medical narcissism and decided to break their silence and defend the alternative point of view. In essence, the alternative health community has exercised their right of free speech against the narrow-minded prophecies of the QUACKBUSTERS. This, not surprisingly, has infuriated Dr. Barrett and Dr. Polevoy and the many persons and/or entities that follow them. As is typical of self-deputized vigilantes, Dr. Barrett and his supporters believe that the protections of the First Amendment only apply to them."The suit asks the court for a permanent injunction, to prevent all the defendants from engaging in the "improper and unlawful conduct" described in the legal document. It also calls for general and compensatory damages, which they put at $10 million.


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

Anti-SLAPP Laws and the InternetBy Edmund B. (Peter) BurkeSummary: Anti-SLAPP laws -- designed to help defendants defeat "strategic lawsuits against public participation" -- are now being invoked in cases involving statements made in cyberspace. In one case, a California court applied an anti-SLAPP law in a dispute over allegedly defamatory comments posted in a web site. This article explains the relevance of anti-SLAPP laws and the First Amendment to the Internet, focusing on the California case. Author: The author of this article, Edmund B. (Peter) Burke, is a member of the GigaLaw.com Editorial Board and co-chair of the technology and intellectual property law practice at Kritzer & Levick, P.C., in Atlanta. He negotiates complex software, hardware and information technology agreements and practices in many areas of intellectual property and high-technology law. He is licensed to practice law in the state of Georgia. E-mail: pburke###akl.com.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------Introduction to Anti-SLAPP Laws and the InternetSEE ALSO Raising the Bar on Online AnonymityThe Legal Debate Over Protecting Anonymous Speakers OnlineThe Limits of Free Speech on the Internet A California trial court has ruled that the state's anti-SLAPP law applies to statements made on the Internet because it is a "place open to the public or a public forum." The court also applied the republication immunity protections (Section 230) of the Communications Decency Act (the "CDA") to shield a newsgroup user's re-posting of a defamatory statement written by another party. The well-reasoned and thorough opinion will provide guidance for Internet users and courts in future resolutions of free-speech issues.SLAPP is an acronym for "strategic lawsuit against public participation." In California, a defendant in a SLAPP lawsuit may bring a "Special Motion to Strike," and show that the actions complained of are in furtherance of his right of free speech. Specifically, this may be established by showing that the statement forming the basis of the defamation suit was made in "a place open to the public or a public forum in connection with an issue of public interest."The California anti-SLAPP law was passed to address what was perceived to be a disturbing increase in lawsuits brought primarily to chill the valid exercise of the constitutional right of freedom of speech. The anti-SLAPP law is a procedural device that is designed to secure the prompt dismissal of SLAPP lawsuits unless the complaining parties can meet the stringent criteria under the anti-SLAPP law. As this case shows, this can present a formidable hurdle to claims of libel and slander.While the anti-SLAPP law was designed perhaps to address the problem of relatively under-financed private individuals who speak out against corporate interests, the California courts have held that even powerful media defendants can take advantage of the anti-SLAPP law. Thus, Time Warner won a dismissal of a suit against it in M.G. v. Time Warner, Inc., decided by the California Court of Appeals earlier in 2001.Applying California's Anti-SLAPP Law to Alleged Defamation OnlineThe plaintiffs in the California case, Barrett v. Clark, filed a lawsuit, which was determined by the court to be a SLAPP suit, against several individuals who were alleged to have defamed the plaintiffs. However, the protections afforded to the defendants by the anti-SLAPP law, and by the immunity provisions of the CDA, proved to be insurmountable obstacles to the defamation claims. Thus, the defendant's Internet-based speech was essentially shielded by the combination of the First Amendment and California's anti-SLAPP law.Two of the plaintiffs, Dr. Stephen Barrett and Dr. Terry Polevoy, devote much of their time to exposing medical quackery. Dr. Barrett, a retired psychiatrist and a medical journalist, has achieved a national reputation as a consumer advocate and has appeared on the Today show. The doctors were also interviewed on a two-part PBS television broadcast concerning one of the defendants, Hulda Clark. Dr. Barrett runs the "Quackwatch" web site, which describes itself as a guide to health fraud, quackery and intelligent consumer decisions.The third plaintiff, Christopher Grell, is an attorney who has a "special interest in cases involving health fraud or harm caused by herbal products."The defendants in the case were individuals involved in advocating "alternative medicine." The case report is revealing as to the meaning of "alternative medicine" in this context. According to the complaint, Hulda Clark is an unlicensed naturopath who operates a clinic in California and Mexico, who claims that all cancers and other diseases are caused by parasites, toxins and pollutants. According to the alternative medicine advocate in question, these diseases can be cured within a few days by the administration of "low-voltage electric current, herbs and other non-standard modalities."From this, it's evident that such activities would be grist for the mill of a web site such as Quackwatch. However, the lawsuit was not about quackery itself, but about the right of the quacks to criticize the traditional medical establishment without fear of retribution by way of expensive lawsuits.The court found that the statements made on the Internet by the alternative-medicine advocates satisfied the anti-SLAPP law's requirements as both "issues of public interest" and as "made in a place open to the public or a public forum." The "public interest" criterion does not require that the issue be one that is currently in debate in a legislative forum; it is met, the court decided, if the statements in question impact a broad segment of society, or if they affect a community in a manner similar to the actions of a government entity. A California court had held in 1999, for instance, that statements critical of the biographer of the author Jack Kerouac qualified as statements "about the public interest" because the author was an important literary figure.After the court in the Barrett case found that the anti-SLAPP law applied, it was incumbent on the plaintiffs to prove that they are likely to prevail on their claims. This included making a showing that the statements made were false, that they were defamatory, and that the false and defamatory statements caused monetary damage to the plaintiffs. The physician plaintiffs in the case were unable to make these showings at the early stage of trial, and therefore the alternative-medicine advocates were entitled to a dismissal of the case without having to defend themselves in a full-blown trial.In particular, the court found that many of the statements made were simply expressions of subjective judgment about the quack-busting physicians. The alternative-medicine advocates had claimed that the doctors themselves were "quacks" and that Dr. Barrett was "arrogant" and a "bully" who had tried to "extort" the defendants. The court was not impressed with the claim that these statements were "factual" and therefore entitled to redress under the defamation laws. Rather, the court found the statements analogous to another case in which a high-school teacher had been called "the worst teacher at FHS" and a "babbler." Mere vituperation, in short, is not entitled to legal redress via the defamation laws; insulting someone through name-calling is not the same as making false factual accusations.The plaintiffs pointed to only one factual statement, that Dr. Polevoy had stalked an advocate of alternative medicine. This statement was made in a newsgroup posting by defendant Rosenthal. However, a Mr. Tim Bolen, not defendant Rosenthal, had authored the statement about the stalking; Rosenthal merely allowed the statement to be posted in a newsgroup that she maintained (alt.support.breast-implant).Under Section 230 of the CDA, "no... user of an interactive computer service shall be treated as the publisher or speaker of any information provided by another information content provider." The court had no trouble finding that the CDA immunized Rosenthal against postings written by another party. The plaintiffs' remedy was against the writer of the statement, if one was to be had; Rosenthal, as a mere Internet intermediary, was not responsible for the content of the statement itself.As if the defeat for the plaintiffs were not complete enough, the court also noted that in any event the plaintiffs were to be treated as "public figures" in the context of the dispute, and that under federal constitutional principles, they could not recover in the absence of a showing of "actual malice" by the defendants -- that is, by a showing that the defendants knew the statements to be false. Honest belief, in short, was a complete defense to the defamation claims, even if the statements had been determined to be both false and defamatory.***


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

The Last Days of the Quackbusters - Revisited... Opinion by "Consumer Advocate" Tim Bolen November 3, 2001 There was a day when the "quackbusters" were a force to reckon with. But now, they've been beaten so soundly, in so many places, over so many issues, that they have no credibility left. They are, simply, nothing to fear. Their teeth have been pulled. The court case they recently lost in California, "Homeopath Smashes 'Quackpot Menace' in California," was more than just one more victory for the forces of good. It was a MILESTONE in the war against quackbuster evil. THE IMPORTANCE OF THE "HOMEOPATHIC" COURT CASE... In this current assault against health freedom by delicensed MD Stephen Barrett and his minions, the National Council Against Health Fraud (NCAHF), had posed as an injured Plaintiff using what's called California's "Private Attorney General" law. Basically, Barrett, et al, were claiming that about fifteen manufacturers of Homeopathic products in the USA were "fraudulently advertising" homeopathic products, asserting that "homeopathy has never been scientifically proven - therefore, it is fraud." This first case, the one decided on Hill Street in Los Angeles, was filed against Frank King, and King Bio Pharmaceuticals (www.kingbio.com) of Asheville, North Carolina. Barrett rushed this one to trial, I believe, thinking he could get an early victory against a small manufacturer of homeopathic products - and use that victory to bludgeon larger producers into cash settlements. It didn't work. Barrett's strategy backfired. He, in his mega-arrogance, didn't count on members of the Health Freedom Movement setting up an ambush, right there on Hill Street. Barrett, and his cronies, walked right into it. Scott Pinsky, Frank Hill's attorney in California, assembled a strong defensive case, based on the simple premise that "The NCAHF presented no evidence that the health discipline called Homeopathy was fraudulent." It worked. Pinsky, during the actual trial, also had the backing of famed California civil litigator Carlos Negrete - a serious veteran of courtroom wars. The combination crushed the NCAHF - easily. The NCAHF really didn't have a case... Barrett had based the whole NCAHF case on HIS OWN opinions, and had used his own writings as his so-called evidence. SO, IF THEY DIDN'T HAVE A CASE, WHY DID THE NCAHF PROCEED AGAINST THE HOMEOPATHS IN THE FIRST PLACE? Good question. The answer is complex, I believe, and centers around two important factors: (1) a desire to counter the growing number of humiliating losses the "quackbusters" have been suffering, around North America, at the hands of Health Freedom activists. (2) Bad leadership. When John Renner was still alive, he held the annual meeting for the NCAHF in his home town in Missouri. All of twenty-five stalwarts showed up for the annual event. The turn-out was so pathetic, Renner had to down-size his meeting plans several times. In contrast, Health Freedom activists can put 100 activists into a coffee-shop meeting on two days notice - and can deliver, literally, thousands of people to just come and "stare" at Medical Board members during quarterly meetings - anywhere in North America. Stephen Barrett took over management of the NCAHF after Renner died - and decided to use it, I think, to bolster his own "testifying business," the one he uses www.quackwatch.com to promote. Barrett runs his business out of his basement in Allentown, PA. In order for Barrett to continue to generate business, he must make it appear to attorneys out there, that he has a good product to offer. His product, he claims, is "anti-quackery testimony" for which he demands a significant fee. But Barrett's problem, and the problem of all of the so called "quackbusters," is that in order to command those "significant fees," he (and the others) have to have a track record of "victories," an attorney can rely on. Of late, Barrett, et al, have been battered in the courtroom - with opposing attorneys simply questioning their credentials. Everybody remembers "quackbuster wanna-be" Robert S. Baratz's submission of false employment claims in the Phillips case in Florida - so he could be paid as an "expert witness." Attorneys all over North America learned a few simple lessons from the Baratz incident - if a "quackbuster" comes to testify, FIRST carefully examine their resume claims, then lead the "testifier" through cross-examination right through those "false resume claims" right into a PERJURY situation. If they want to lie in a courtroom - let them do it - then exact the penalty. But it isn't just about lying, or misrepresenting, in a courtroom. In Barrett's case, and others, attorneys are now carefully examining Barrett's personal qualifications to testify AT ALL. After all, it must be remembered that Barrett, not only couldn't become Board Certified as a Psychiatrist, but he had to give up his medical license for reasons he doesn't satisfactorily explain, in 1993. The obvious premise here is - if he couldn't make it in the SIMPLE world of "drug prescribing" how can he claim to be an expert on COMPLEX "leading edge" health disciplines? Attorneys, all over North America, have been asking just those types of questions of Barrett, et al. And Barrett doesn't have satisfactory answers - ones that would satisfy Judges and juries. Attorneys who previously counted on Barrett, et all, to make their case, have been finding out, the hard way, that Barrett can't stand and deliver. The message now is "If Barrett is your 'expert witness' you are going to lose your case." The bottom line here, is that Barrett needed, what he thought would be, a "slam dunk" to restore his previous reputation as an "expert witness who can win cases." He didn't get it. In fact, on Hill Street, he got the opposite. NOW, BARRETT'S GOT REAL PROBLEMS WITH HIS OWN PEOPLE... Barrett, and others, had touted this attack against the Homeopaths, and others in California, as the quackbuster's return to prominence in the field of Health Policy. His plan fizzled miserably. Now, I think, Barrett has credibility issues with the whole "quackbuster" membership. He simply can't deliver... Tim Bolen


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

I was trippin' by and saw smoke...someone wound Donna up today eh?







I gotta run...Happy Hour...and did not get to read all the gory details and play-by-play, but a copy of my comments from another thread with a parallel discussion...losely linked to this revelation...may or may not add something ______________________________"Comment:" __________________________________"Perhaps someone can explain to me why there is such a great fear of the FDA on the part of certain posters to this website. See the thread at:" (party A)___________________________________"Click the link and read my comments. I was not present, but I know the people, patients, and commentators in these discussions and I think that someone is either misunderstanding someone or atributing motives and fears to a lay person, a patient, that do not exist. I know of no one in my field or profession or any of the doctors or dieticians I work with or any of the thousands of patients they have cared for who harbors "fear of the FDA"....or anything else for that matter. On the contrary it is one of many agencies which is an integral part of practing the delivery of healthcare services in the USA.heck save the time here is a copy of my comments--------"Note":________________________________"Certainly you are not advocating that ALL oversight of medicine alternative or otherwise be ended???"_________________________________"No. Where these all-or-nothing motive attributions come from beats me LOL. I do not think anyone, even patients who have achieved remission for the first time in their lives after living through hell, thus can be emotonal about it, are advocating such a thing.No, but what shouild be advicated is to do away with only that which is biased and ill informed masquerading as oversight, where due diligence on what something actually is, is not performed before defamatory material is published. To publish defamatory material without basis in fact is libelous and actionable, as well as unethical from one who has taken an oath to medical ethics. But like anything else corrective action takes money to pursue that is better spent elsewhere, until one gains the assets to do so. You have to weight the actaul damage against the cost of correctin the source, and ins some cases the damage is at a given time minimal, buit at other times can be significant. Its a cost-benefit analysis.These aspects have naught to do with the FDA, only those who seek to set themselves up as judge and jury, then are intentionally careless and malicious with whatever little influence they may peddle.That, I beleive, is reasonable to seek correction of. MNL____________________________Res Ipsa Loquitur.There is an old Iranian Proverb: "The mud you throw will surely fall on your own head."Good words to live by.Eat Well. THINK Well. Be well.MNL


----------



## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Can you PLEASE stop posting a comment that is now so totally out of context of mine all over the frigging board.I hate having to clean this up and try to explain it OVER AND OVER.PRetty much all the anti-quackwatch postings here got stuck on an FDA fraudulent health post.Tarring the FDA with the anti-Quackwatch brush didn't make sense to me (so I said something INTENDED TO SHOW THAT).I didn't mean they ACTUALLY felt that way, but that they seemed to be tarring the FDA with something it didn't deserves.Like since Quackwatch is bad and FDA also fraud-busts FDA is also just as bad....that was the point that you MISSED..... Asking was this the arguement that they were trying to make because otherwise it didn't make much sense to blast the heck out of quackwatch on an FDA thread...Unless you want to infer BOTH are bad.Because stuff was deleted the comment got OUT OF CONTEXT.Posting it all over the frigging board makes it even MORE AND MORE out of context and it is really annoying to me that you are doing that.K.


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

Oh yes I am wound up ...but I feel much better now...This quackwatch guy really got to me...When I read this nuts opinion on a test that helped me and then when he can state a company names Oh yes I get wound really tight...Kmottus , I really do apoligize for what I did on the other post,,,Thank God for the FDA and I really mean that...I shouldnt have put quackwatch on the other thread...I am very sorry but even though I was upset I had no reason to do that...I dont get my opinion over to well with others and really mean no harm...I have said over and over and over that I need to say what worked for me..I am here to cause no harm to others...just to share my experience....But, I will defend what ever method, what ever way I was able to get some help with IBS & CVS...and everyone has their own opinion and You are right I shouldnt have posted that quacks statement on the other thread..but I am tired of people doing things when I share my experience....Ok sorry Mike that I am here being a trouble maker







I am on my way to Mr Smith's of Georgetown so once I get there I will feel alot better....







I hope


----------



## Julia37 (May 9, 2001)

I hadn't seen these quackwatch articles before. They're very interesting and heartening!I usually don't go looking for things like quackwatch because I get so upset, it could ruin my life and health if it happened too often - I'm so glad they got punished in court! People like this Barrett person try to control everyone to conform with their narrow little view of reality - this is the root cause of almost all the bad things in the world. I've known people like that, it seemed like there were a lot of them around in Kansas when I was growing up - I think it's a mental disorder. Whether it's a religious fanatic, or a militant health nut, or a power-mad executive - the disease is the same, only the issue it's projected on is different. Bleah, I need to stop thinking about it before I get upset and scared.


----------



## flux (Dec 13, 1998)

> quote:They're very interesting and heartening!


Hardly. They are *criminals*.


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

KM _____________________________________"Because stuff was deleted the comment got OUT OF CONTEXT." _____________________________________I assume you mean the one about "removing oversight". Sure I understand what you mean re: the statement, and was indeed puzzled by that contectual reference. But my intent was not to draw attention to you, or the comment used to draw attention to you personally, rather to the comments I made thereafter which wer related to many other discussions in those areas of the board and once clipped it just lay there as the precursor to my commenst about the quackies.I will be happy to delet it from those posts and allow what I said to stand on its own. My intent was not diorected at you but at certain aspectes of those who set themselves up as judge and jury and proceed to perpetrate that which accsue others of perpetrating.Unless someone came back to read the comment it would appear anonymous. But I will edit it out for you as I did not intend to offend you. If I did intend to draw attention to you personally, I would have put your identity there with it.MNL


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

I agree with the statement by Mike that it is easier for people in academia to get published. Very often when papers are sent out for reviews they are sent to supposedly experts in that area. Experts are usually from academia and if the author is an academic, the expert is probably someone known to her and that makes the road to publication that much easier.


> quote:Hardly. They are criminals. [Insert graphic]


I see, flux, you haven't lost the old touch, LOL. Who said, "the more things change the more they remain the same"?. I know the French version of the saying. Anyway, very appropriate.


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

JuliaIs that guy a quack or what







Mike I have settled down alot today...







I am back on track...Another wonderful weekend...Georgetown was very interesting Friday night...I met someone called Johnny...that sit next to us and I found out he was really a women







I think he was a cross-dresser but he looked like he had all the parts that women have







Needless to say it was a wild evening.....So Yep we took a walk on the wild side...







Glad to be back in reality


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

Hey, where di you eat in Georgetown? I used to go there alot to do postproduction on industrials and TV ads and stuff and always was surrounded by undeniable temptation to swallow Immodium and caste my fate to the chefs!did you "handle" them (the restaurants) or they you? and if so how? Curious....MNL


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

MikeI ate at Mr Smith's in Georgetown...I was able to tolerate the food that I had there...I had a rib-eye steak and it had mushrooms, onion, peppers and chesse on it and it was wonderful...No problem with the food at all...salad and baked potatoe...I even drank a soda...With no problem and the most wonderful thing about the whole trip was that I wasnt scared to eat out and wonder if I was going to be able to make it home..I dont drink soda to ofen because some of them has the sodium benzonate in them...Now the name brand like coke I havent seen that on the label...but with Ginger ale it is on the label... After I ate we walked around and went to a few stores like Barnes & Nobel and stopped by the Crazy Horse for awhile....Do you remember that place







It was just a fun filled weekend...My Girlfriends and I really got lost coming out of there this time we drove around the monument for probably 1 hour...I am so happy I can have fun like this again







I think I told you but my life now is just like being a kid all over again


----------



## Jan LEAP RD (May 19, 2002)

One more comment about Barrett and Quackwatch.Some time ago I noticed that Barrett denounces "Thought Field Therapy" as quackery. TFT, also known as "The Callahan Technique" or "the 5 minute phobia cure" is a 'looks too good to be true' therapy that helps eliminate phobias. (for more info, www.tftrx.com)My husband was trained in TFT some years ago. He does TFT and unconditionally guarantees he can remove simple/individual phobias in one session, or he gives a client their money back. He has never been asked for a refund yet.I personally have seen the benefits when I panicked while rock climbing in the mountains! My sister (50+ years old) has had claustrophobia since she was a kid. (Teach your sons not to threaten to sister their little sister with pillows! hehe)She couldn't tolerate small spaces, OR bear hugs by big guys, or wearing tight clothes that had to be pulled off over her head. . . After one session, she has NO more claustrophobia, even now, 2 years later she says she never gives it a thought.I have seen the therapy work on family/friends and client with lifelong fears of snakes, spiders, height, falling and more.So, is it quackery? When nothing else worked and it did the 'trick' in 20 minutes or less?This is one of the reasons this FORMER MEMBER of Barrett's group, "The National Council Against Health Fraud" DROPPED her membership quite a few years ago.







Thanks for letting this Registered Dietitian vent with another point of view about Barrett.


----------



## flux (Dec 13, 1998)

> quote:So, is it quackery?


Yes.


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

MikeNL, I got a statue of Krishna with long hair for you. Thought you would appreciate that







. Don;'t know why I am saying it here instead of in an e-mail. Oh ! I remember. Because ohnometo spoke about cross dressers and this Krishna has an androgynous face. So..... Anyway don't know if you would appreciate Krishna with an androgynous face. If you wouldn't, just say the word and I 'll find another one for you


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

BonnieAre you home yet ? Hope you are safe where ever you are







Jan, just ignore Flux he has got in trouble more then once here...







He only has knowledge about gas intolerance


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

There is no such thing as a statue I would not appreciate as you describe. An androgynous face is an artisitic attempt to depict the mono-dualistic nature of the personality. Feel free







MNL


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

Jan....When were you a member? Long ago or recent (if you feel comfortable "sharing").MNL


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

MikeJan has been here before....This isn't her first post..and I am glad that she has decided to join us....Someone needs to keep you in line


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

Oh Donna I missed this: _____________________________________"I had a rib-eye steak and it had mushrooms, onion, peppers and chesse on it and it was wonderful" _____________________________________OMIGOD!!!! You little -----!!! Do you know what I would give (esp. at my age where I am more willing to give up body parts for food) to have a little fully-dressed-ribeye? I have not eaten a steak for at least&#8230;10 years&#8230;and I was a dedicated carnivore many years ago. Big part of the problem.But then again I know what awaits me if I do. I can see it, smell it taste it adore it!!!!







MNL


----------



## WashoeLisa (Sep 12, 2000)

Oh yes- that steak does sound soooo good!Fortunately, I can eat all the stuff on it and "it" itself- Sorry, Mike! Eat that wheat and think of me drooling over here, OK?Lisa from Nevada (pronounced with a short "a", not like that guy on TV promoting the new show "Push, Ne- vah-dah)


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

That is an interesting viewpoint. Mono-dualistic. Had to think a bit about what it meant. One God with two forms? I hope you like the statue, Mike. It is made of sandalwood. You have to brush it to release the fragrance of sandalwood. Haven't quite figured out with what to brush it, though







ohnometo- I am still in India- it doesn't look like there is going to be a war as much as the Americans might want it. Oops! Better not go there and touch this topic anymore or there might be a war on this BB.







.Thanks for asking







Steak huh? I am drooling over all the sweets my mother has made which I have found out I can't touch







What a deprived life!


----------



## WashoeLisa (Sep 12, 2000)

Hi Bonnie,I am so glad you are safe there-- and super glad to know that war is not likely.I know alot of people were praying for a peaceful outcome to this latest tension.What a lucky guy, Mike! The statue sounds beautiful!Lisa from Nevada (short "a" in Nevada)


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

That was so nice to think of Mike on your trip...I am sure he would appreciate it very much..One of these days I want to go to India..That has been on my list for quite a while now...I made it to France, Spain, Italy...So next is India, and Greece...Take care and be safe


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

Ugh...fevered brow replies in ballon-head style.... _________________________________________"Sorry, Mike! Eat that wheat and think of me drooling over here, OK?" _________________________________________yes I do forget to count among my blessings my own regained tolerance for wheat, which some of you do not get to share. My apologies for whining about No Steak Bombs for me (that's what they call them at John Smith Subs) _________________________________________"Mono-dualistic. Had to think a bit about what it meant. One God with two forms?" __________________________________________Pretty much...without getting side-tracked on the thread into Hindu theology, one precept is that God is God, so as God "he" has infinite forms otherwise how could he be God if he/she is limited to only a certain number of forms...and every virtue of Divinity is both unlimited and is personified. So that particular personification is the most unique and highly revered, and possesses the characteristic of a single form which is two forms of opposite sex melded inseprably yet apart into one form as a manifestation of a very specific attribute of Divine Peronality. It is almost impossible to explain in terms of language, but the best word is mon-dualistic..two forms yet one yet two.







____________________________________"I hope you like the statue, Mike. It is made of sandalwood. You have to brush it to release the fragrance of sandalwood. Haven't quite figured out with what to brush it, though" ____________________________________I guarantee you I will apprerciate it more than you can know, and it will fit perfectly in my home which does have a certain "content" of art and object d'art from India as my part of the "decorative contribution to the home. MrsNL gets the rest. When I was single that was how my home was exclusively decorated ("Eastern culture" if you will). I look forward to it greatly. _________________________________"What a lucky guy, Mike! The statue sounds beautiful!" _________________________________I am certain, of both. ___________________________________"I am sure he would appreciate it very much.." ___________________________________You can take THAT to the bank!Echh where is the Ibuprofen???MNL


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

MikeNL, I hope you are feeling better and the Ibuprofen worked. Take care







BTW I _thought_ you made up the word mono-dualistic but then again English is not my first language. I thought, "who knows?!" LOL


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

> quote:"What a lucky guy, Mike


I'll say I am the lucky one to know someone like Mike who has an appreciation of the eastern culture and religion. Also to know someone who is so instinctively diplomatic- agreeing that he is the lucky one, LOL.


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

ohnometo, India can be both disappointing and enchanting at the same time- disappointing because of all the poverty and filth there but enchanting due to every thing else


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

The Land where the term "paradox" was defined. Oh, and I cannot take any credit....I did not make up mono-dualistic, it was used many times by english speaking analysts of the Indian scriptural writings I have read.Well, gotta get movin...on the road again today!MNL


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

Oh, missed itSI feel the same…with my hands…but my fever is down enough to don my Road Warrior garb and strike-out to the north again!MNL


----------



## WashoeLisa (Sep 12, 2000)

India sounds like a really wonderful place to visit. I have had many Indian friends and the smells of curry always take me back to my childhood and playing at my friends' homes. That's on my someday list of places to go.Bonnie,Yes, Mike it definitely one of a kind!







And you are obviously a pretty special person yourself! Donna,I'd love to visit those places too! I've been to France, England, Germany (saw the Berlin Wall and touched it even!), Italy, Monaco, Mexico, Canada and Brazil (Rio de Janeiro is a hoot when you are 21!!). But there are sooo many other places I want to see! I do love to travel and hopefully, the money will come again when the kids are older so we can go on more adventures!Want a traveling companion???







Mike,Wow- I'd love to see all those wonderful Eastern art objects! Sounds very cool! My own personal taste tends to lean towards Disney and Winnie the Pooh in particular! (I have loved Pooh since 1969!) Oh, and I do like lots of pine and an old fashioned look (candles,ect) with lots of family pictures all over the wall. Not very sophisticated, but very homey.Hugs all around,Lisa from Nevada


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

> quote:And you are obviously a pretty special person yourself!


I won't ask you why. Bad habit of mine! I'll say "Thanks"! BTW I am getting Mike this statue because we were discussing Indian religion and I realized Mike knew a lot about it and so in that context, since I was In India, I thought I could get him something which was relevant to the discussion. It isn't expensive or anything especially with the foreign exchange rate. And is about six inches high


----------



## WashoeLisa (Sep 12, 2000)

Bonnie,I'll answer your "why" just because! Because you are always so pleasant on this BB and I enjoy reading your posts. AND because you were thoughtful enough to get Mike a small gift that would mean something to him- no matter how inexpensive. Its the thought that counts, as they say.And you are one thoughtful person- that's WHY!







Lisa from Nevada


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

Thanks, Washoe Lisa


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

Hey, and more good news, I checked into my hotel in Jacksonville last night and find:a. I am afebrile in time for my meetings todayb. there are (2) new Indian restaurants within 1/2 mile of my hotel in either direction andc. there are (3) Chinese restaurants within 1/2 mile in any direction andd. Hardees' totally safe (for me) and totally cheap fried chicken, mashed taters, and biscuits is at the corner not 300 feet away.







Heaven, I'm in Heaven







And...the dinner meeting is NOT SCHEDULED TO BE AT ANY INFERNAL ITALIAN RESTAURANT like usual!!!(Lord, it seems like whenever I come back to this town, where I lived for 10 years or so before, all we ever eat is Italian, bar-b-q and seafood...not that it's a BAD thing, esp. Bono's...the best Bar bq in Florida! But I just cannot 'do' mlore than a little italian even when I swallow a whole handful of IBSACOL).But I am surrounded by safe food, and may not even need to fire up this stove here!Eat well. Think well. Travel Well. Be well!MNL


----------



## ohnometo (Sep 20, 2001)

Guess what Mike...I can eat all the Italian Food I want to ....







I watch the Lasgana because sometimes they make it with cottage cheese...butfor the most part of it I can eat...and all the steaks that my heart desires....







My My such a good life today


----------



## WashoeLisa (Sep 12, 2000)

This could be our new salutation:"Wishing you safe restaurants and happy travels"!










































Bonnie,You are more than welcome! Just tellin' the truth!Lisa from Nevada


----------



## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

Lucky you, Mike! Wish I could say the same about my travels. There are plenty of Indian restaurants within easy reach but it's like "water, water everywhere but not a drop to drink".


----------



## Mike NoLomotil (Jun 6, 2000)

PRESS RELEASE: ________________________________________"And...the dinner meeting is NOT SCHEDULED TO BE AT ANY INFERNAL ITALIAN RESTAURANT like usual!!!" _________________________________________They lied! Deviants....spawn of the Devil!!!Seems a lot of that was going around yesterday: http://www.ibsgroup.org/cgi-local/ubbcgi/u...t=000307#000005 MNL


----------



## Julia37 (May 9, 2001)

Mike, Italian restaurants are very popular here also. For those who don't have food issues (that they know of) it's great - comforting, tasty, satisfying. I could go for a pizza now myself.







Most of the restaurants here offer a dish of pasta and fresh veggies, usually with pieces of chicken, tossed in olive oil.I haven't been in that situation yet but that's probably what I would order. I'm not intolerant to marinara sauce but too much gives me acid.


----------

