# Rose/everyone - does psyllium really CAUSE gas and bloating?!



## Guest (Feb 22, 2000)

hi there,I was reading Rose's post about bloating - and it seems that psyllium is a cause of gas and bloating!This is terrible news for me - as I used to be really badly c - and since taking daily psyllium this has improved a great deal and I can usually have a bm each day - it is even almost normal!!Everything was hunky dory for weeks and months - but now I am suffering from a LOT of gas and from bloating. It is so uncomfortable and embarrasing







I thought that when you first started taking fibre - you got gas and bloating - but once your body settled down and got used to it - you were fine - ?this seems to be working in reverse for me!I feel like this:







please help!! I don't know what to do... I daren't stop the psyllium for fear of having awful c again... but the gas and bloating is getting out of control!


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## JeanG (Oct 20, 1999)

Hi Enna:Some people can tolerate psyllium quite well. Unfortunately I can't so have to take other types of fiber. Since it seemed to be ok at first, have you changed your diet drastically in other ways? Added tons of fiber all at once? Fiber has to be added in slowly, and remember to drink a lot of water with it.Maybe someone else here who can take psyllium have to answer to whether or not it would cause bloating now.







I liked your graphic!







JeanG------------------Member of "The Advance Guard for the Ozone Rangers".May the "farce" be with you. JeanG


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2000)

If you had been taking psyillum in the past with no problem I would say you should be lookinh elswhere for the criminal. You can also try phazym for gas. I just added some extra calcium to my diet and have had a terrible reaction with gas, ouch!


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## Rose (Mar 25, 1999)

Enna, yes psyllium does cause gas, and gas causes bloating. You are exactly right in what you said, that the gas and bloating should subside once your body becomes accustomed to the added fiber. The operative word here is "should". In my case, my body hasn't adjusted, even after many years, but I continue to take it, because, for now, it's the only thing that works for me. I tried a flax poweder called Fiber Smart..but it didn't "do" a thing for me if you know what I mean. It's a "damned if I do", "damned if I don't situation." If I don't take my psyllium based fiber product, I can't move my bowels, so I'm bloated and uncomfortable anyway.By the way, I love your little piggy!







------------------"Today is the first day of the rest of your life"Rose [This message has been edited by Rose (edited 02-22-2000).]


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## flux (Dec 13, 1998)

Remember lactose intolerance? Because once again, science has found that the gas and bloating from psyllium doesn't appear to be real. http://www3.infotrieve.com/medline/infotrieve/detail.asp?nmed96-98+978453+"(suarez,+ f):AU"://http://www3.infotrieve.com/medline/...suarez,+ f):AU"://http://www3.infotrieve.com/medline/...suarez,+ f):AU" [This message has been edited by flux (edited 02-22-2000).]


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2000)

Flux, tell my tummy that when it swells up like a beach ball and I can't move because it hurts too much.


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## SteveE (Jan 7, 1999)

flux--you're link didn't work for my CPU, but I went to pubmed and typed in a search consisting of psyllium, gas, & bloating for keywords. I came up with one article (see below), but I have some problems with it:1) It's only ONE study.2) It has an n of only 25.3) It must not be the study you were referring to because this one agrees that the gas isn't real, but the bloating symptom did occur with fiber therapy.4) They describe the participants as "healthy," but at the end they say that bloating is indicative of IBS (and treated accordingly whatever the heck that means). Perhaps this would've made more sense if they screened a couple of different groups of healthy and IBS types and then did the study. Did the study you mentioned do that?The relation of passage of gas an abdominal bloating to colonic gas production.Levitt MD, Furne J, Olsson SVeterans Affairs Medical Center, Minneapolis, Minnesota, USA. OBJECTIVE: To determine the relation of gas passage and abdominal bloating to the production of gas in the colon. DESIGN: Randomized, double-blind, crossover study of gaseous symptoms during a 1-week period. SETTING: A Veterans Affairs medical center. PARTICIPANTS: 25 healthy medical center employees. INTERVENTION: Participants' diets were supplemented with either a placebo (10 g of lactulose, a nonabsorbable sugar), psyllium (a fermentable fiber), or methylcellulose (a nonfermentable fiber). MEASUREMENTS: All participants were polled for gaseous symptoms (including number of gas passages, impression of increased rectal gas, and abdominal bloating), and five were examined for breath hydrogen excretion. RESULTS: Participants passed gas 10 +/- 5.0 times per day (mean +/- SD) during the placebo period. A significant increase in gas passages (to 19 +/- 12 times per day) and a subjective impression of increased rectal gas were reported with lactulose but not with either of the two fiber preparations. Breath hydrogen excretion, an indicator of hydrogen production in the colon, did not increase after ingestion of either of the fibers. However, a statistically significant (P < 0.05) increase in feelings of abdominal bloating (which the participants perceived as excessive gas in the bowel) was reported with both fiber preparations and with lactulose. CONCLUSIONS: The physician should distinguish between excessive gas (which indicates excessive gas production) and feelings of bloating (which are usually unrelated to excessive gas production). Treatment of the former consists of limiting the supply of fermentable material to the colonic bacteria. Symptoms of bloating usually indicate the irritable bowel syndrome, and therapy should be directed accordingly


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## SteveE (Jan 7, 1999)

Oh...uh, BTW...the scientists are welcome to give me some psyllium and watch the fireworks anytime.


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2000)

Hi there everyone - thanks for your quick replies...Jean - I don't think I have changed my diet drastically - i have been trying to be healthy - lots of pasta and fruit and veg and cereal - but I always eat pretty much like this - and it never made me feel quite this bad before...tequlila - what is Phazym? can i get it in the UK - what is in it?Rose - I know just where you are coming from with the do i take it or don't I dilemma! I just know that if i cut down on fibre I would get such bad c again...







I can't seem to find many alternatives to psylliu over here though - not that really work like this does!







Flux - are you saying that lactose can cause gas and bloating? I don't drink much milk as it is - only on my breakfast cereal. do you think i should try cutting it out?Steve - I do agree with your reservations too! it seems to be a pretty small and not really proportional study? And I too would LOVE to know what "Symptoms of bloating usually indicate the irritable bowel syndrome, and therapy should be directed accordingly" is supposed to mean - treat me accordingly! please!!


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2000)

just another thought - i usually wake up feeling fine in the morning and my symptoms get worse over the day until I am feeling quite misereble by the time i get home from work.....not fun...


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## Guest (Feb 22, 2000)

Actually i'm not sure if you can get phazym in the UK. I don't think Flux believes gas and bloating are real just figments of imagination.


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## eric (Jul 8, 1999)

Enna, this is just a question, but are you drinking beer? Seriously.Here are some pages you can read. http://www.gicare.com/pated/psyllium.htm http://www.gicare.com/pated/ecdgs06.htm ------------------ http://webpotential.com/ericibs/index.htm


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## missbonnie (Feb 12, 2000)

Hi there! I also suffer from terrible gas and bloating from psyllium fiber, but there are alternatives my friend! My doctor switched me from that to Citrucel, which is methylcellulose fiber, and it is non-allergic, as opposed to psyllium, which many are allergic to. He told me to mix one tablespoon in at least one full glass of water twice a day, once right after breakfast and once right after dinner. This helps me very much, and I do not get gas pains or bloating like with the psyllium. I hope you can find this products, because it works wonders for me! And I feel for you, I know how uncomfortable C can be with this terrible IBS! Let me know if it turns out ok with the methylcellulose fiber!------------------Thanks and feel good,Bonnie


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## flux (Dec 13, 1998)

> quote:flux--you're link didn't work for my CPU


Jeff, is this fixable?


> quote:1) It's only ONE study.


It's one of the stud*ies*.


> quote:2) It has an n of only 25.


That's fine. A lot of studies like these are small. Big studies of this type are expensive and unwieldy. However, there are always more studies coming.


> quote: 3) It must not be the study you were referring to because this one agrees that the gas isn't real, but the bloating symptom did occur with fiber therapy.


No, this is one of their earlier studies. Note the bloating was perceptual. No real bloating was measured.


> quote: Did the study you mentioned do that?


They asked for people who felt that fiber gave them gas and bloating. I don't know exactly how many IBSers they actually got.


> quote:Flux - are you saying that lactose can cause gas and bloating?


If you chug-a-lug it, it probably would.[This message has been edited by flux (edited 02-22-2000).]


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## Rose (Mar 25, 1999)

Bonnie,I am glad Citracel works for you, but unfortunately for me it made things much, much worse. I was more bloated than ever after taking it, and on top of that I couldn't "poop" to save my life. Different strokes for different folks, I guess







------------------"Please Take Time To Stop and Smell the Roses"Rose


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## SteveE (Jan 7, 1999)

flux--I see your point about the subjective nature of the bloating symptoms, but like pain it is all we have to go on since pain can't be measured any other way. Feeling bloating or fullness or whatever you want to call it is no less valid a sensation than feeling pain.How would we measure bloating? Just going around the belly with a tape measure seems to be rather limited in both reliability and descriptiveness. Certainly if I'm describing myself as bloated, it has to do as much with a feeling of hardness or pressure in the abdomen as it does the increase in the distention.


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## flux (Dec 13, 1998)

> quote:whatever you want to call it is no less valid a sensation than feeling pain.


Yes, but the point is that what one senses doesn't necesarily give an indication of the underlying problem.


> quote:Certainly if I'm describing myself as bloated, it has to do as much with a feeling of hardness or pressure in the abdomen as it does the increase in the distention.


No, just perception of bloating means that one feels bloated even though there is no change in girth.


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## joan (Feb 13, 2000)

MY GUT SWELLED TO LOOK 8 MONTHS GONE. IT HURT. I CALLED IT BLOAT. NOT GAS, I FELT, BUT SLOSH OF GALLONS OF LIQUID IN THERE PRESSING PRESSING PRESSING. TONIGHT I READ THAT THE LIQUID MAY REALLY BE IN THE PERITONEAL CAVITY AND BE REAL BLOATING, OR THAT ABNORMAL MOVEMENTS AND CONTRACTIONS OF INTESTINAL MUSCLES GIVE A FALSE SENSE OF BLOATING BECAUSE OF INCREASED SENSITIVITY TO GAS. THE ADDRESS IS WWW.NIDDK.NIH.GOV/HEALTH/DIGEST THEN SOME MORE STUFF I DIDN'T COPY DOWN.ARE YOU DISCUSSING LIQUID IN THE PERITONEAL CAVITY OR ARE YOU DISCUSSING GAS HERE? AND WHY WOULD ANYONE IN HIS RIGHT MIND THINK THAT GAS BLOAT IS NOT REAL BLOAT? MY DICTIONARY SAYS TO EXPAND OR DISTEND AS WITH AIR OR WATER, TO BECOME SWOLLEN. SO THE TAPE MEASURE SURELY DOES SOUND IN ORDER HERE.


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## Guest (Feb 23, 2000)

thanks everyone for your comments - it really is a horrible problem.I'm not sure I can get Citricel over here - but I could look for something with similar ingredients - but I am not sure it is the psyllium that is the problem - as it didn't cause bloating and gas before and I have been taking it for months. i have been racking my brains trying to think what I might be eating that i wasn't before - but I can't think of anything. I am eating a lot of fruit and veg - but i am loathed to cut them out of my diet as they are healthy and i adore them!







Eric - I don't drink much gassy fizzy beer at all - occassionally - I drink Guinness more than anything else if I go out to the pub - and that is not gassy at all.thanks for the links - they were very interesting. But I am still feeling confused.I tried not having cereal with milk today and had only one teaspoon of psyllium instead of 2 - not sure if it will help though - i think I am willing it to be caused by lactose - cos i don't really like milky dairy things anyway and could give them up... unlike fruit and veg... mostly i eat apples and bananas and grapes and carrots and leeks and brocolli and potatos.I can't imagine what i would eat if i cut these out!!!


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## JeanG (Oct 20, 1999)

Hi Enna:Are you eating a lot more fruit than before? I know that if I eat more than 2 pieces a day I get gassy. Could it be that?JeanG------------------Member of "The Advance Guard for the Ozone Rangers".May the "farce" be with you. JeanG


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## Guest (Feb 23, 2000)

no not more than before really - usually just an apple with my lunch - sometimes a banana too...


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## JeanG (Oct 20, 1999)

Hi Enna:It could possibly be the dairy. I know I've become sensitive to milk and use soy milk instead. Maybe if you try cutting that out for a while? I noticed a big difference when I did, much, much less gas, unless I'm very constipated.What's happening with your hormone levels? Any changes there? Just fishing for answers here.







JeanG------------------Member of "The Advance Guard for the Ozone Rangers".May the "farce" be with you. JeanG


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## Guest (Feb 23, 2000)

hi Jean,yes I hope it is the dairy, fingers crossed.can you become sensitive to it when you were fine with it before? and even if you are only having very little?how do i know what my hormone levels are?


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## JeanG (Oct 20, 1999)

Hi Enna:Re hormones, I was just wondering if your menstrual cycle is regular? I know when mine is way off strange, bizarre things happen to my body!







You never know.







JeanG------------------Member of "The Advance Guard for the Ozone Rangers".May the "farce" be with you. JeanG


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## Guest (Feb 23, 2000)

I see!everything else is fine really - regular as ever (touch wood).i sometimes feel worst just before my period - but this time I have felt like this for weeks and my p is a good week and a bit off yet...


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## Bugsyboi (Feb 21, 2000)

Hi EnnaSince Psyilium has worked to regulate you and make your BM's almost normal try cutting back a bit on the dose or take smaller doses a couple of times a day. This should cut down on your bloating. I did the same thing with Citricil with some success. Hope it works let me know.Bill


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## Guest (Feb 23, 2000)

Hi Bill - thanks - I have been thinking along those lines too and have cut down from 2 teaspoons twice a day to just one teaspoon once a day! But i have been putting in bigger teaspoons thinking it might help to up the dose again as i am feeling bad...I am not being very scientific am I!!!I will try just taking one teaspoon once a day and see what happens!thank you.I will also cut out the milky things...bet it won't make the slightest bit of difference!!!


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## maggiew (Jul 3, 1999)

Flux, you are welcome to come smell my "perceived" farts from my "perceived" gas and bloating any time I take psyllum. Tell me it is not real!Enna, try cutting down on wheat too. That is a big gas trigger for many of us. Do you eat a lot of pasta/cereals/grain/pretzels/etc? If I eat even one pretzel I am miserable. Have you changed your diet any?------------------Praying for a cure for this NASTY IBS!


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## Rose (Mar 25, 1999)

Enna, just a thought, but bananas are suppose to be binding so I avoid them with a ten foot pole. Also I find grapes and brocolli to be extemely gassy. I love brocolli, but had to stop eating it. ------------------"Please Take Time To Stop and Smell the Roses"Rose


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## Guest (Feb 23, 2000)

I didn't want to say anything earlier but the last couple posts are correct, pastas, breads, brocilli and bananas do cause gas, or "percieved gas". Go to your doctor and ask what meds the UK provides for gas you must have something there. Take care.


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## Guest (Feb 23, 2000)

ooooo maggie and tequila!!!I have been eating an awful lot of pasta of late...and I mean LOTS...pasta salad for lunch - tagliatelli or spagetti for dinner!yum yum!!!i didn't know it was bad for gas?!I saw something on tv that said it was very good for you and gave you lots of energy! and i thought - great! I love pasta and have gone somewhat mad on the stuff!!!wow - I might try another thread to see if many people have probs with pasta...thank you for the suggestions! keep them coming!!!







Rose I try not to eat too much brocolli as I know it is mean to be a bit of a gassy one! - oh but i do love it!!!


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## eric (Jul 8, 1999)

Enna send me an email to falcon###webpotential.com------------------ http://webpotential.com/ericibs/index.htm


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