# Immodium causes petrification of mucous



## BertAPU (Feb 24, 2004)

Hello all...according to the warning slips on Immodium here in Romania, regular daily use causes the mucous in the intestines to petrify--harden. Of course, is this is to happen then it is not good. They say for chronic diarrhea to use for a month or so, and then take a pause for a week or two--whatever your body can handle--before you begin it again. It sort of makes sense to me because I have seen mucous in my stools become quite pasty and chalky after large doses of Immodium.Anyhow, this has come up so much I thought I would let you all know in case you want to consider it for your health as well. Take care all.


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## dtp (Jul 10, 2003)

> quote: Of course, is this is to happen then it is not good.


What exactly is wrong with 'petrified' mucous? Is it dangerous in some way? (I don't mean to imply that it is not.)


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## BertAPU (Feb 24, 2004)

Okay, I meant to type "Of course, IF this is to happen then it is not good" because mucous helps to not only digest your food, but to move along the food, bacteria (good and bad) and nutrients in your GI tract. If it hardens then 1) your system will not flow properly and 2) and this is only according to the doctors here, hardened mucous can then lead to other abdominal problems such as blockage, pockets, and even cancer.


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## pinupgirl1948 (Aug 6, 2003)

Is this long term or does it go away when you go off Immodium?


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## degrassi (Jun 10, 2003)

I"ve taken immodium every day for 6 years and have never had a problem. But if you do notice that it is effecting your mucous then maybe taking breaks from it isn't a bad idea.


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## Homebound (Jan 27, 2000)

I've never heard of such a thing. Even if it did I'm not seeing why that's so dangerous. Not everyone has mucous in their stool anyway. Not only that if I even skip one day of Immodium I'm right back to D (and mucous). I took it every day straight for 6 years, never had any problems with it.Besides I have a life to live, I can't sit in my house for 2-3 weeks so that I can take this break because of mucous. LOL If I could take that kind of break, my guess would be that I really didn't need it to begin with! Sorry but I'm not concerned.


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## knothappy (Jul 31, 1999)

Me too no concern, as long as the Imodium blocks me up enough to go out and have some kind of life once in a while. I take 4 a day and have been doing it for years, yet I still have a bad day off and on. If I donot take it, I have terrible D that will not stop day after day. My GI doc is from Cleveland Clinc and he says I can take it for the rest of my life if I have to, and up to 8 a day if the 4 quits working. So if I only have a limited time of life because of this, so be it>> better than walking around with #### hanging out of your pants leg, with big watery brown stains on a white pair of slacks and stinking to high heaven, and do not kid your self,people know you crapped your pants when you have an accident, Ido not care if you have a Depends on or not. Don't babies stink up the room with a crappy diaper??


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## BertAPU (Feb 24, 2004)

Folks...this wasn't supposed to be a big deal. I never even said everyone has muscous IN THEIR STOOL. The fact about Immodium is that it petrifies the mucous IN YOUR GI TRACT. And yes, EVERYONE has mucous there. It is the most basic part of the digestive process. What I said was that the mucous in your GI tract will harden (or at least "can" harden) and if it does then it can be dangerous. I am fully aware that not everyone passes mucous in their stools.Of course, you may listen to your doctors. Especially if you have good ones, but the fact remains that, more often than not, doctors are not very personally involved in their patients and we know this. I have a great GP, but the others could go suck an egg for all I care they are so heartless, cold and rude. So, please listen to their opinions about Immodium if you wish.The problem is not a serious one if you can take a break from time to time from the Immodium. Try huge quantities of pepto bismol for a couple days to take a break.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

I'm just confused somewhat by how whatever it says in Romanian labels translates into English.This is not something I think I have ever read on packaging in the US and it would suprise me that ONLY the romanians know about this.I mean mucus can dry out, so maybe that is what they are talking about (like antihistamines could dry out mucus in the nose making it harder to unstuff than if you didn't take them...why taking just decongestants when you are stuffy rather than a combo drug is sometimes the best bet).When you say petrified (usually means hardened by addition of minerals in English) or even hardened. Does it sound like it is stays in the GI tract coating the lining with a hard layer of stuff (which is the only thing I could think of the "might be dangerous") that isn't something that I know has been seen, but usually in a colonscopy you've been cleaned, but some alt. med types claim everone has dangerous build up of gunk in the colon.Dried mucous might make it a bit harder to pass a stool, but taht usually isn't anything "dangerous".I'll look on google and PubMed to see if there is anything other than one romanian statement about it (which is I think why people are doubtful and confused by this....would not this be on English packaging). And I do not know who well the Romanian is translated into English, and translation issues can also lead to some pretty harsh misunderstandings.NIH drug information the closes I got was "dry mouth" so some drying sort of thing but no dangerous hardening of the mucous (unless Romanian drug labelers believe that is what causes constipation????)On PubMed all I can find is a few papers that talk about how Imodium can reduce the amount of colonic mucous in rats....PubMed may not have all the Romanian Journals on it, so maybe they know something no one else in the world knows, but I am still confused. You would think the FDA would make them put this on the US label if it was a demonstrated side effect.On the other hand at least in mice with cystic fibrosis they can use imodium strangely enough to help thin the mucus in the respiratory tract (overly thick mucus is an issue) but how that is different in normal mice they didn't find out.Looking at the rat papers is seems the mucus is less, but thinner (which doesn't add up with thicker, hardened, petrified????)Confusedly yoursK.


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## BertAPU (Feb 24, 2004)

kmottus, do you care or even believe what the FDA says? You think that they actually have our health concerns at heart or is it another way of controlling the economy, ultimately, our pocketbooks? The reasons that they approve of certain meds and not others makes no rational sense to me. There are many excellent medicines available in Europe that are not available in the U.S. Europe doesn't follow the same rules that the U.S. government does in most things--for example, the meat market. Most U.S. beef (as we all know now) is not even allowed in the EU because they believe that with all the things we add to the meat we are hurting ourselves...this being said, I am not surprised at all that warnings about immodium are not the same in this country or in the U.S. In any case, I was simply trying to relay some information so that people can make informed decisions for themselves. If nobody has experienced these symptoms for themselves then FANTASTIC.These are the adverse reactions listed that I did not mention:ConstipationDistensionIleus (acute chronic intestinal obstruction)Abdominal PainMeteorism (don't know what this is)NauseaVomitingDryness of the throatVertigoInsomniaHypersomniaSkin Eruptions (Hives)If you don't trust my translation, here it is in Romanian:Loperamida este, in general, bine tolerata. Pot sa apara urmatoarele reactii adverse: constipatie si/sau disensie abdominala, asociate in cazuri foarte rare cuileus, in mod particular in cazurile in care indicatiile de prescriere nu au fost respectate. Dureri abdominale, meteorism, greata, varsaturi, uscaciunea gurii; reactii de hipersensibilitate (eruptii cutanate); vertij, oboseala, somnolenta.Have fun with the translation.In any case, I use four immodium every day.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Then all science including everything on pubmed is bad (an much of the European research is there, at least what gets published in English and most of the major French, German, and Italian journals..I've seen some other odd languates in the).How can all the info by the gov'ts of Europe be unbiased, but all FDA is totally suspect. I take everything with a grain of salt, but the FDA does REQUIRE that ALL, EVERY SINGLE ONE, of the side effects seen in the well controlled studies that must be done are listed on packaging info. The drug side effect info was from NIH but that is what would be on the packaging HERE.Why are you so upset that I am CONFUSED!!!!!!!!!!Sorry, I didn't get the memo that you are the font of all truth and knowledge in the world.Now I know.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

PS FDA is not the drug companies and does use independant scientists in their reviews.They are not a board put together by the drug companies. They have their biases and faults LIKE ALL GOV'T bodies, even the ones in the EU.K.PS is isn't a matter of "trusting" your translation, but translation as I know from trying to translate Chinese is a very tricky business.I do not know if your version is the standard translation, or the best guess you picked out of the dictionary, or how a fully trained MEDICAL doctor completely fluent in BOTH languages would translate it. Technical jargon is the toughest to translate, really it is.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Um....much of it makes sense because latin is a scientific language.mucoasa is what I am expecting to see?? Some of the words are very similar to the medical jargon and all of them seem to be what English writers write.Most of it must be jargon not recognized by regular romanian dictionaries...the words that do not make sense do not seem to be in there.Mind telling me which words in particular are "petrified mucus"? Most of the words I don't know that aren't romanian for mucus according to the online dictionary didn't seem to work.Off to try babel fish.Sorry I upset you so much....really I am just trying to understand where you got your information from since it doesn't seem to jibe with anything else I have ever seen from any source about Imodium.K.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Looking over your list and the other side effects ALL of that looks mostly like what you see in the US, exept the petrified mucus. That is what is so confusing..Checking the on-line PDR, I'm guesing it the information around the obstruction that is what you are translating that way??Definition:	ï¿½	Me"te*or*ism, n. (Med.)Flatulent distention of the abdomen; tympanites.So far no luck with on-line PDR, bK.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

OK, I'm guessing this is the tranlation for what is by IleusConstipation and/or abdominal distension, in very rare cases associated with ileus, particularly in cases in which the prescribing information had not been followed constipatie si/sau disensie abdominala, asociate in cazuri foarte rare cuileus, in mod particular in cazurile in care indicatiile de prescriere nu au fost respectate.From http://www.medsafe.govt.nz/Profs/Datasheet...peramidetab.htm It's from New Zealand so the FDA didn't have anything to do with it


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Here is a UK listing...*	Constipation*	Abdominal cramps*	Dry mouth*	Drowsiness*	Fatigue*	Dizziness*	Nausea and vomiting*	Bloating*	Paralysis or inactivity of the intestine that stops the movement of material through the gut (paralytic ileus)*	Skin reactions such as rash and itch http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/medicines/showp...ion.asp?id=1540 It is everything else matches but the petrified mucus. From contries NOT under the FDA control.PPS. the FDA didn't approve Thalidamide when there were babies all over Europe born without arms because of it. AND some drugs available overseas are not submitted to the FDA, and some drugs the FDA approves other countries do not.It's a mixed bag.Still looking for that petrified mucus...maybe if I do a search in spanish french or italian??K.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

www.farma.ro had a different list, but that doesn't help me find the petrified mucus. I think that is a romanian site??K.


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## BertAPU (Feb 24, 2004)

kmottus...I am making a voodoo doll right now with YOUR name on it...







Seriously, I am on my way to speak to my doctor this moment about it. Be back later.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Still trying to track down the mucus in this...Here is my best guesses as to which is what. There seems to be the same number of symptoms??? so I cannot easily find the mucus.*Constipation	*Distension	*Ileus (acute chronic intestinal obstruction) constipatie si/sau disensie abdominala, asociate in cazuri foarte rare cuileus, in mod particular in cazurile in care indicatiile de prescriere nu au fost respectate.	Constipation and/or abdominal distension, in very rare cases associated with ileus, particularly in cases in which the prescribing information had not been followed *Abdominal Pain Dureri abdominale*Meteorism (don't know what this is) meteorism,*Nausea greata*Vomiting varsaturi*Dryness of the throat uscaciunea gurii*Vertigo vertij*Insomnia oboseala,*Hypersomnia somnolenta*Skin Eruptions (Hives) reactii de hipersensibilitate (eruptii cutanate)Loperamida este, in general, bine tolerata. Pot sa apara urmatoarele reactii adverseMy best guest.Loperamide is, in general, well tolerated. But adverse reactions are seen The only word I am having problems with isurmatoarele. BUt that wouldn't be the mucus????Awaiting your response, breathlessly, enlighten me with the font of your complete omniscience.Damn...that sarcasm got switched on again





















K.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Seems to have to do with as a consequence of...or something like that.Which makes sense being next to adverse reaction sorts of words.Well, until I am told where the petrified mucus is in the Romanian, I'll just have to wait.I'm out of translation skills/resources...although it is almost worth the 25 Euro's to get it translated professionally just to satisfy my curiosity.K.


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## BertAPU (Feb 24, 2004)

Kmottus, "urmatoarele" means "the following" or "the things that follow." Thus, "pot sa apara urmatoarele reactii adverse" means "The following adverse reactions can appear." Pot comes from the verb "to be able" and "urma" as a root means "follow." "Urmatoarele" is the feminine plural possesive. Now, please don't spend your $25 on a translation.I am not all knowing, and never even implied that in my posts. I do, however, remember many people inquiring about the safety of using Imodium daily ("zilnic" in Romanian if you are keeping a journal...) and, rather than responding to each and every post I thought I could add a new post with some new information. My feelings regarding the FDA--having something to do with controlling the economy of the pharmaceutical companies in the US--have nothing to do with me being "all knowing." It is simply an opinion. Whether or not they, or anyone else, puts "all" the known symptoms in a warning sheet is their call. The fact that you don't believe my doctor is your perogative. But you do not need to be so high and mighty with your own opinions. If you don't agree with her then fine, don't agree. But let everyone else make their own decisions as well. Science has hardly answered all of the questions in the world...I cannot believe that you find it difficult to accept something "new." Anyhow, it's your call what you want to believe. I am NOT here to defend what I believe. Now, I made one mistake in saying that the warning is on the prospect sheet included with Imodium (and by the way, this product is not even manufactured here in Romania, it is manufactured in Belgium). My doctor is the one that told me this when I asked her about the advantages of using Smecta (a liquid intestinal "bandage" only available in Europe) over Imodium. She said that while Smecta helps to heal the mucous ("mucoase") in the GI tract, and thus helps to heal the entire GI system, Imodium only helps the colon. Additionally, Imodium causes the mucous to "atrophy" and NOT "petrify" (forgive me my mistake here) but only after long extended uses without a pause. She said (tonight) even a few days pause would give the body enough relief to repair. When asked why this isn't listed, she said because most people do not use Imodium on a daily basis and there is no need to put this information there. But from her 20+ years of working the emergency room of a hospital, she and her fellow doctors firmly believe that daily use without pause for months on end is not good for the colon. What is so hard for you to believe about this? I use it daily anyway, and I have no problems with it, but I certainly will take to heart her suggestions.Incidentally, when I contacted the FDA through a letter regarding Smecta, they responded that they do not divulge whether or not they are researching a medicine, whether it is available or when it might become available. You can read all this and more of their policies on their website. But Smecta, whose main ingredient is "diosmectite" is the anti-diarrheal drug of choice here in Romania and it has (in my opinion) much better effect on diarrhea than Imodium. Why do I still use Imodium then? Because I can swallow a pill much quicker than I can prepare the solution (Smecta is a powder that is suspended in water or tea). Why won't the FDA approve this medicine for the U.S.? I would love to know the answer. I would also love to hear how IBSers in Europe who use Smecta have responded.Finally, back to my original post, I wanted everyone to know that this "might" happen. Knowledge is important, and while you may not believe what some experienced doctors in eastern Europe say does not make it untrue. Likewise, just because the FDA or other notable Euro drug organizations do not mention this side effect does not make it any less true.I have never felt like I was all knowing, and for just wanting to pass on some useful information that some might find useful, I do resent being slammed with a dozen posts by you quoting you've learned from your research. I ALREADY KNEW WHAT YOU POSTED, and that is why I posted what I did because it was a side effect that WAS NOT listed on the prospect sheet inside the box.I will think twice about sharing anything else on this forum. I get sick of all the "experts" who play scientist and doctor and then debate the accuracy of a statement made by a fellow person as if we were in an FDA medical conference or were publishing a medical journal. This is a "normal folks" bulletin board with normal people who have normal experiences and want to learn from other people's experiences. I do, however, appreciate all the personal responses from people who have learned from and through their own experiences are all willing to share this with others. We can all read an FDA warning sheet, but they are not exhaustive and hardly personal.


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## careena (Nov 3, 2001)

> quote:and that is why I posted what I did because it was a side effect that WAS NOT listed on the prospect sheet inside the box.


Yeah but you *did* post that it said it on the package insert. Just like you, many people here take this drug every single day. When you make a post that tells people it will petrify their mucous, you got to expect someone will question it. Kmottus took the time to research what you posted and found out that what you posted wasn't true. Then you back tracked and said your doctor told you that. You could have just said your doctor told you that to begin with.Regardless of what your doctor said, everyone here has a doctor and no one else has ever mentioned, since I've been coming here, that your mucous gets petrified. Sorry, sounds like a wacky doctor to me. I do medical transcription, and one of my accounts is a GI doc. I've never seen a report yet of a person with petrified mucous.


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## leslie204 (Feb 1, 2003)

Ok... Heated discussion going on here that hopefully isn't going to make us all crazy.. Personally, I think Robert has given this board a European view of IBS D that we will never be able to find anywhere else. He definitely suffers as we all do. That to me is obvious from his posts. I always believe in taking everything with a grain of salt and so the Mucous thing that started this whole debate may be important to 2 people in the whole world and unimportant to 2 million. So? Robert has posted some very interesting remedies for IBS D and how they treat it in Romania. He so obviously has the disease so I just kind of feel like you all should just take in the information and use it or don't.... It's not worth the lenghty debate. Back to the mucous or 'petrified' mucous... I was actually more healthy when I had mucous in my stools because the white mucous ALWAYS used to accompany a very normal BM. Sorry I am in the defensive mode but I think Robert Allen has been very helpful, very informative and definitely not an 'I know it all' kind of person at all. Forgive me if I'm wrong but... on another note, hope you are all feeling well today.Leslie


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## BertAPU (Feb 24, 2004)

Leslie204, thank you for your support. My best intentiones were at heart. I wasn't trying to make a ridiculous claim to begin with. I appreciate it.Careena, I know that I did post that it said that on the package insert. Does that matter? I was reading the insert with my doctor when I asked her about taking Imodium every day. I confused our initial conversation with what was written (thinking they were one and the same thing) and said it was written on the insert. Of course I backtracked--I never realized what I said wasn't clear until the questions came pouring in. But it doesn't make me a liar for pete's sake.And you insist that what I say is NOT true just because Kmottus found some statistics from half a dozen websites? And if your read my last post more carefully even my doctor said that you have to take it a long time without any break. Even my doctor said it is easy to avoid "even a few days pause..." and yet...Look...there are many people on this board who have asked about long term effects, I asked my doctor WHOM I TRUST (and why the hell shouldn't I? She's helped me completely from day one when I arrived with IBS-D) what her opinion is and that is what she said. Take me to court and sue me if you don't like the fact that I was trying to relay some information. You all act as if I intended to make a ridiculous claim just to scare everyone. Thanks for raking me over the coals.


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## dtp (Jul 10, 2003)

RobAlan:Thanks for the info. A multiplicity of perspectives is always a good thing. Especially when it's related to such important things as the side effects of drugs that many of us take every day. Cheers.


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## Twocups424 (Mar 26, 2002)

RobAlan,I thought you were using Calcium and it was helping. Did it stop working for you or was I mistaken?


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## BertAPU (Feb 24, 2004)

twocups424, yes, I have been taking Calcium. It was working for me for about a month. But I couldn't stop the distension or gas or whatever the bloating was. I tried taking the Calcium with my meals, without my meals, at different times of the day, in different combinations, etc., but I was still very distended. Additionally, while my stools were formed, I was going a minimum of twice a day and not at regular times. This would be fine if I was working in my office and had regular access to a bathroom, but working here is too risky to never know when a BM was coming. I work with orphans in a third world country and I don't have the option of using a restroom any time I need it. In the past I would have to excuse myself suddenly (to their surprise of course) and run home--about a 15-20 minute walk--use the restroom and then come back. The immodium gave me more regularity as far as the frequency goes.When I go back to the states I will use calcium again because I think it is safer. I even had lab work done after taking so much extra calcium and it turns out that my calcium levels are actually normal and my magnesium levels are higher than they should be. Go figure!


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## careena (Nov 3, 2001)

I'm sorry Rob, I shouldn't have said anything.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Rob...Yes, it does make a difference if something is "what the doctor said" vs "what is on the package insert".One can be one person's opinion (and we have had plenty of instances of people being told things by their doctor that is completely screwy, like Lotronex is GREAT for people with constipation predominate IBS and insist that the person try it even though they have read all the research and KNOW they should not, and cannot convince the doctor of anything".Things that are on package inserts, regardless of country, are things that most scientists who study these things say are true.Now mucous to atrophy, some of what I posted DOES seem to support THAT idea. That the mucus thins, at least in the animal research.K.(who actually IS a scientist and doesn't just play one on TV





















).PS which is why I really dug into the statement. I wanted to understand where it was coming from, because it was akin to saying "there is a unicorn in my backyard" In science if the data is there will believe you, but we gotta get the data. I'm sorry if I was too hard on you, but I wanted to get to the bottom of this unicorn. This was a very different thing that anything that I had ever read (all available data) and you were posting it as if it were something very dangerous and I thought that many people who might be helped by Imodium would avoid it to prevent the petrification of their mucus because that sounds really scary.That's why I got into the discussion. I really didn't mean to put you on the defensive, but wanted to get to just how this "fact" came to light.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

To clarify, package inserts, and that sort of info tends to be what we would call a consensus document.Many people, usually with different agendas, all agree that it is the best take on the facts that we have.While they may not be the absolute truth, it is something that people who generally do not want to agree on anything, will agree about.Most government scientific things are this way, at least in the US. You get people in the industry, people who deal with the adverse effects of that industry, etc together and lock them in a room until they come up with something EACH AND EVERY one of them will sign. Usually it is something that makes everyone equally unhappy.K.


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## BertAPU (Feb 24, 2004)

kmottus, wait a minute...you don't have a unicorn in YOUR backyard? I've got one in mine...hmmmm....check again...


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## abigailcrane (Mar 26, 2004)

After reading these posts I did a little research on the drug being discussed. I myself cannot take Immodium it causes rashes, dizziness, vomitting so I discontinued using it I have acid reflux disease like I need to make my guts worse..any how after reading up on the side effects this is what I found.Drugs such as LOPERAMIDE,ANDIAL,DIARLOP,ELDOPER,IMODIUM,PELOPEM & RIDOL (Many of the names give for basically the same drug)SIDE EFFECTS: dry mouth, vomitting, dizziness stomach pains, drowsiness, constipation, fatiqueMORE SERIOUS: skin rash, hives, itching, wheezing , difficulty breathing.Read this on one site LOPERAMIDE may decrease transti velocity & increases the ability of the gut to retain fluids.Reduces stools and the course of diarrhea.LOPERAMIDE has a high incidence of severe side effects besides fluid loss in the ileus, including lethargy, respiratory depression and coma. WOW and my doctor gave me this drug to take, and I asked him if it had any side effects and he told me no. Took the Loperamide and 2 hours later I was covered with hives and itching my brains out. Like all drugs some work for others and some do not. In my case I couldn't take the drug. But since the LOPERAMIDE causes fluid loss...(dehydration perhaps it could cause hardening as Rob stated) I want to read more in regards to this...I have a friend who is a pharmacist gonna pay him a visit tomorrow and ask him about the side effects. Will keep you posted in regards to this and what I find.If anyone is interested in these sites where I find these tid bits..here they are. http://www.cps.ca/english/statements/N/N03-01.htm and this one http://www.mdbrowse.com/Druginf/L/loperamide.htm Enjoy reading and if posting these sites is a NO NO...sorry to have done it...just thought the findings interesting. Take care and God Bless.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Well Rob already clarified, finally after much prodding, that it wasn't hardening, but atrophy (becoming less) that is the concern of this Romanian Doctor.It isn't a concern the Romanian (Or EU depending on who is regulating such things) seems to think is something that needs to be on the warning labels (or any other country I can find).There is some vague evidence in the medical lit that might support this view, but I do know in 6 month long studies with Imodium in IBSers taking it daily there wasn't anything that I would say as so dangerous you have to stop taking it for one week a month or anything like that. But that may not be a bad precaution for those who worry.Perhaps you haven't heard the unicorn in the backyard analogy, so I am sorry if that caused you any concern.Basically it is when someone states a scientific (or medical) finding that is completely new and unexpected, a different level of questioning and proof is needed before one just goes "great that is neat, gotta include that in my scientific world view".I get that you wanted to spread the warning, but people do need to have an accurage view of any warning as a whole lot of total misinformation gets posted here that someone got told by their doctor. Which is why I tend to check up on Unusual Claims. I do have the training and background to do that







It is like when (can't remember his name off the top of my head) said that prions were infectious protiens (what causes mad cow disease) at the time it was an OUTRAGEOUS claim, but he did the work to back it up.Now this doesn't rise to that level, and I get the impulse to post every hazard that everyone hears about from every source, but misinformation can be very dangerous. With Imodium it probably isn't a big deal, but in other cases it can be.So what I guess is people want EVERY claim to be completely unexamined and unchallanged on this board????Now the hives thing IS on all the labels for all countries, but that is something that almost all drugs cause in some people, so it is not unique to Imodium, but this doctor was wrong, I don't believe Romanian doctors are completely and totally infallable either, but who knows, maybe they are







I hope not







K.


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## dtp (Jul 10, 2003)

Quoting AbigailCrane:


> quote: LOPERAMIDE has a high incidence of severe side effects besides fluid loss in the ileus, including lethargy, respiratory depression and coma.


This quote that you posted was taken from a website that was concerned with 'diarrheal disease' in children. If you read the whole page you'll find that they really seem to be concerned with infants (they give recommendations regarding breastfeeding). The sources for their listing of side effects are two articles. The first is called "Loperamide Poisoning in Children" and the second was published in a pediatric journal.On my bottle of Imodium at home it doesn't even give a dosage for children under 6 years of age (it says 'ask a doctor'). Taking quotes out of context is dangerous (especially when using the internet as a research tool) and misleading.


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## abigailcrane (Mar 26, 2004)

Gaston not to be rude...if you look above there was no indication of me quoting anything or I would have said *quoted* I said I read this on this site and I DID put the URL's there for others to read after all I'm not a doctor so I put the URL's there for others to decide for them selves and to read for themselves and form and opinion. What I really dislike on this site is the bashing that goes on and the verbal attacks when someone makes a comment that they do not like. For this reason I'm leaving this site and not returning, for everyone is entitled to their own opinions and after all is this site not for the soul purpose of helping each other not bashing one another. If information is put on this site that we do not agree with then it is up to us to research that information for ourselves not bash nor degrade others. Misleading you say Gaston? That is why I left the site URLS for others to read for them selves, after all I'm not a doctor and do not understand the doctor mumbo jumbo, and what I might interpret may be totally different from someone elses view. Oh I get it. I'm not suppose to have a point of view. Sure this was research done on children, but after all if it is having this effect on a child could it not have similar effect upon us? Maybe the effects just takes longer? Who knows. Do take care everyone and God Bless.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Rob....Just wondering about one other translation potential issue.If it is OK to ask a question.(mostly this comes under the why the doctor might have said it was dangerous).Was it atrophy of mucus (which would be thinning of the mucus layer...this is what I thought we were talking about)Or atrophy of the muccosa (the mucus membrane layer) This I could see a doctor being more concerned about. I would think that if this occured it would be really rare as many IBDers (who have damaged mucous membranes to begin with...(aka Mucosa) often take high doses of Imodium daily for years without damaging themselves)However there are always rare side effects that happen to very few people.Heck there is one case of a person taking Imodium in the med lit that needed methadone to break the addiction, but this seems to only be a problem in people with previous opiate addictions that take hundreds of Imodium at a time (a very small amount gets into the CNS and this seems to happen more in infants which is why the warnings are stronger for them. Meaning you can get high off of Imodium, but you gotta take such huge doses that most people do not do that. The prescription antidiarrheals like Lomotil tend to have atropine added. Besides being an antispasmodic it also tends to counteract the addiction issue with these medications as taking Lomotil at a dose that gets you high gives you a dose of atropin large enough that you cannot enjoy it).But odd rare things do happen with all medications, herbs, foods, etc.K.


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## BertAPU (Feb 24, 2004)

Good question. "Mucus" is called "Mucoasa" here and I do not know what they call Muccosa. Good luck.


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## dtp (Jul 10, 2003)

AbigailCrane:


> quote: if you look above there was no indication of me quoting anything or I would have said *quoted*


The indication of your quoting (despite the obvious lack of quotation marks) is that you preserve the EXACT wording from the site with the exception of the single word 'also'. This includes such arcane phrases as 'besides fluid loss in the ileus'.


> quote: Misleading you say Gaston? That is why I left the site URLS for others to read for them selves


Indeed! It is absolutely misleading to post information that says Imodium can cause people to lapse into coma when that information is taken from a site that's obviously about 'diarrheal disease' in young children. I do appreciate your posting the URLs. One of the good things about this board is that all posts are subject to peer review. By posting the URLs you helped move that process along.


> quote: after all I'm not a doctor and do not understand the doctor mumbo jumbo


C'mon. The site is called "Treatment of diarreal disease". It's hosted by the Canadian Paediatric Society. It was published in "Paediatrics and Child Health". The paragraph from which you non-quoted uses the phrase "infants and children with gastroenteritis". That's not 'doctor mumbo jumbo'.


> quote: Oh I get it. I'm not suppose to have a point of view


You are totally welcome to have your own point of view. I wouldn't think otherwise for a moment. And I hope nothing I said in my previous post indicated anything to the contrary.


> quote: Sure this was research done on children, but after all if it is having this effect on a child could it not have similar effect upon us? Maybe the effects just takes longer?


These are legitimate questions. But you didn't raise them in your original post. You merely posted a claim to the effect that loperamide "has a high incidence of severe side effects besides fluid loss in the ileus, including lethargy, respiratory depression and coma". This claim is misleading because it seems to only apply to children (as far as the cited research is concerned) and you didn't mention that fact. Lots of people around here use Imodium. If they read a post that claims that Imodium has a high incidence of side effects such as COMA (!!!!) they might stop taking it and/or spread the disinformation. I know you posted the URLs but that doesn't remove all responsibility on your part.


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## abigailcrane (Mar 26, 2004)

I was well aware that the site was for children Gaston Adults are not the only ones that suffer from IBS just thought the site might interest those with kids that suffer. And yes you are probably gonna say that I should have said that. Well this is a forum and I'm not writing a novel. IBS D does not just effect adults it effects children as well. I have had it all my life it grew worse after the removal of my gall bladder. As for me saying about the doctor mumbo jumbo. I'm sure we can all relate to that when we have gone to the doctors and instead of talking to us in words we understand they forget and talk to us as doctors so one is sitting there thinking *What is this guy talking about* This is what I was referring to when I made the comment. Not that this site was in no way full of bologne just that I did not understand the medical terms spoken. If I offended anyone with my post I apologize. Now I'm really out of here. Good day...and God Bless.


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## BertAPU (Feb 24, 2004)

I hear you abigailcrane...I wasn't prepared to present my findings like I was writing for National Geographic. It's rather depressing. I am not a scientist either. The best to you!


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