# relief for gas



## Pete (Jan 20, 2000)

Well after much experimentation I finally found out something that works for me for excess gas. I have had this problem for years. The first thing that worked like a charm was antibiotics. Neomycin, Biaxin, flagyl, doxycycline, and cipro all got rid of the gas 100%. I would alternate them every few months. Problem was it would always come back and then another 10 day course would keep it away for another few months. Probiotics especially culterelle seemed to give me more gas. Well I found a probiotic that works. It has kept the gas away for close to 6 months now. It is called vsl#3(www.vsl#3.com)It tastes awful but I finally found something that works. I just want to share the information. I don't know if it will work on its own or whether it should be done after a course of antibiotics. I just no that I will never stop taking it. I'll post an update in a few more months to make sure the gas is gone for good. Just a warning- It did give me more gas for the first 3 days but then that subsided.Pete


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## fred (Nov 22, 2001)

Pete, it does not appear to be available at the moment from the web site. Where did you purchase it? How much does it cost?What antibiotic(s) did you take that finally helped you?


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## fred (Nov 22, 2001)

Pete, it does not appear to be available at the moment from the web site. Where did you purchase it? How much does it cost?What antibiotic(s) did you take that finally helped you?


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## sstorm7 (Nov 15, 2000)

The website is http://www.vsl3.com Pete, some questions:How did you get ahold of this anyway? On their website it says it's not available yet. There's a clinical trial section, but it wasn't working when I tried to look at it. Are you in a trial for it? Did you find it in a store? How did you hear about this to begin with? How much does it cost? Sorry for all the questions, but if this really works, you'd be my HERO.Susan


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## sstorm7 (Nov 15, 2000)

The website is http://www.vsl3.com Pete, some questions:How did you get ahold of this anyway? On their website it says it's not available yet. There's a clinical trial section, but it wasn't working when I tried to look at it. Are you in a trial for it? Did you find it in a store? How did you hear about this to begin with? How much does it cost? Sorry for all the questions, but if this really works, you'd be my HERO.Susan


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## stinky too (May 21, 1999)

Thanks Pete for the update. For a long time I have wanted to try the anitbiotics but having been on them most of my life for sinus and ear infections I did not think that they would help. However if this *vsl#3(www.vsl#3.com)*works I may give that a try and if that don't help I will ask the Doctor for the antibiotics to go along with it. This odorous condition has ruined any social life that I may have had in the last 40 years







I just checked out that link and didn't find much info.







I sure hope this proves to be as helpful as it sounds. Is this just for Doctors or can anyone get it??.


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## stinky too (May 21, 1999)

Thanks Pete for the update. For a long time I have wanted to try the anitbiotics but having been on them most of my life for sinus and ear infections I did not think that they would help. However if this *vsl#3(www.vsl#3.com)*works I may give that a try and if that don't help I will ask the Doctor for the antibiotics to go along with it. This odorous condition has ruined any social life that I may have had in the last 40 years







I just checked out that link and didn't find much info.







I sure hope this proves to be as helpful as it sounds. Is this just for Doctors or can anyone get it??.


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## Pete (Jan 20, 2000)

I ordered it from the site. They sent it to me in under a week. I read that it is one of the few probiotics that is proven to have any effect in clinical studies


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## Pete (Jan 20, 2000)

I ordered it from the site. They sent it to me in under a week. I read that it is one of the few probiotics that is proven to have any effect in clinical studies


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## Blair (Dec 15, 1998)

Pete what is your current thinking about CS and there BO causes IBS theory.


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## Blair (Dec 15, 1998)

Pete what is your current thinking about CS and there BO causes IBS theory.


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## stinky too (May 21, 1999)

Pete, I just checked out that site again and it said it wasn't in my basket because that item wasn't in the store, Guess you bought em out..







Can't even get them to give me a price.


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## stinky too (May 21, 1999)

Pete, I just checked out that site again and it said it wasn't in my basket because that item wasn't in the store, Guess you bought em out..







Can't even get them to give me a price.


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## rebel (Jul 17, 2000)

bump


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## rebel (Jul 17, 2000)

bump


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## Pete (Jan 20, 2000)

I had no problem putting in another order. Try emailing this personfpryen###vslpharma.com (FPryen)Please post if this product helps. I am very curious.


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## Pete (Jan 20, 2000)

I had no problem putting in another order. Try emailing this personfpryen###vslpharma.com (FPryen)Please post if this product helps. I am very curious.


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## moldie (Sep 25, 1999)

Joyce, I had the same problem. Pete, are you going to post your story there? It won't show me any of those right now either.


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## moldie (Sep 25, 1999)

Joyce, I had the same problem. Pete, are you going to post your story there? It won't show me any of those right now either.


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## snoopy (Jun 24, 1999)

Hi Pete,I have been reading your posts with interest as I highly suspect I have small intestine bacterial overgrowth and have pushed my g.p. to set me up with a doctor in Toronto who will do the lactulose hydrogen breath test...since California is a long way to go for this! But from what I have read to date on sibo, any type of probiotic supplement is detrimental to this as no bacteria should be found in the small intestine. So I am very curious as to why VSL#3 has helped you so much...since your experience with flagyl and other antibiotics mirrors mine---my symptoms would go away while on these, but return 2 weeks after going off of these drugs. I also couldn't inquire about this product as their website is not functioning. I tried sending an e-mail to the address you gave, but have not got a response to date. Could you tell me if you were definitely diagnosed with small intestine bacterial overgrowth? If so, what were your primary symptoms? How much did the VSL#3 cost and what dosage do you take every day? I am trying to calculate cost/month of this stuff since you said you noticed a major difference after a week on it. Any insights you can give me would be appreciated here.


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## snoopy (Jun 24, 1999)

Hi Pete,I have been reading your posts with interest as I highly suspect I have small intestine bacterial overgrowth and have pushed my g.p. to set me up with a doctor in Toronto who will do the lactulose hydrogen breath test...since California is a long way to go for this! But from what I have read to date on sibo, any type of probiotic supplement is detrimental to this as no bacteria should be found in the small intestine. So I am very curious as to why VSL#3 has helped you so much...since your experience with flagyl and other antibiotics mirrors mine---my symptoms would go away while on these, but return 2 weeks after going off of these drugs. I also couldn't inquire about this product as their website is not functioning. I tried sending an e-mail to the address you gave, but have not got a response to date. Could you tell me if you were definitely diagnosed with small intestine bacterial overgrowth? If so, what were your primary symptoms? How much did the VSL#3 cost and what dosage do you take every day? I am trying to calculate cost/month of this stuff since you said you noticed a major difference after a week on it. Any insights you can give me would be appreciated here.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Snoopy--Based on a survey of the medical literature there is precious little evidence that probiotics are extremely harmful for people with SIBOThe research has been into using probiotics to TREAT SIBO, the results have been mixed as to benefit, but NO DETRIMENT was found.Yep, the small intestine is supposed to have just a few bacteria living in it (won't be entirely sterile) but most probiotic bacteria LIVE IN THE COLON. Some bacteria found in the small intestine are colonic in origin, I have no reason to suspect the probiotic bacteria are more prone to do this than any of the MYRIAD of other colonic bacteria that are sometimes found in people's small intestines that have SIBO. A fair number of bacteria found in people with SIBO's small intestines originate in the mouth as well.In animals they are trying to find probiotic bacteria that WILL live in the small intestine because animals with these bacteria in them grow better/are healthier. At least in the animal studies I believe there was some speculation that probiotic bacteria living in the small intestine regulate the growth of other bacteria in the small intestine in a positive way (IE a few probiotic bacteria keeping other bacteria from living in there)The talk out of CS sounds like it should be bad, but if it is terrible it hasn't been doing it in anything published in the medical literature from the clinical trials using probiotics in patients with SIBO.FWIW probiotic bacteria by definition produce NO GAS from carbohydrates so even if a few manage to live in the small intestine they are not likely to be causing big problems unless the motility of your small intestine is so bad you are quite ill.If you are going to have a test have a Sucrose test rather than the Lactulose test. In the trials where they verify the overgrowth with biopsied material from the small intestine found that the lactulose test tends to be much higher in giving false positive results (you don't got it, but the test says you do).K.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Snoopy--Based on a survey of the medical literature there is precious little evidence that probiotics are extremely harmful for people with SIBOThe research has been into using probiotics to TREAT SIBO, the results have been mixed as to benefit, but NO DETRIMENT was found.Yep, the small intestine is supposed to have just a few bacteria living in it (won't be entirely sterile) but most probiotic bacteria LIVE IN THE COLON. Some bacteria found in the small intestine are colonic in origin, I have no reason to suspect the probiotic bacteria are more prone to do this than any of the MYRIAD of other colonic bacteria that are sometimes found in people's small intestines that have SIBO. A fair number of bacteria found in people with SIBO's small intestines originate in the mouth as well.In animals they are trying to find probiotic bacteria that WILL live in the small intestine because animals with these bacteria in them grow better/are healthier. At least in the animal studies I believe there was some speculation that probiotic bacteria living in the small intestine regulate the growth of other bacteria in the small intestine in a positive way (IE a few probiotic bacteria keeping other bacteria from living in there)The talk out of CS sounds like it should be bad, but if it is terrible it hasn't been doing it in anything published in the medical literature from the clinical trials using probiotics in patients with SIBO.FWIW probiotic bacteria by definition produce NO GAS from carbohydrates so even if a few manage to live in the small intestine they are not likely to be causing big problems unless the motility of your small intestine is so bad you are quite ill.If you are going to have a test have a Sucrose test rather than the Lactulose test. In the trials where they verify the overgrowth with biopsied material from the small intestine found that the lactulose test tends to be much higher in giving false positive results (you don't got it, but the test says you do).K.


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## stinky too (May 21, 1999)

moldie, click my profile, I left a private message for you.


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## stinky too (May 21, 1999)

moldie, click my profile, I left a private message for you.


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## Pete (Jan 20, 2000)

Snoopy,I did test positive for BO at Cedars and was told to avoid probiotics. To really complicate things I recently had a colonoscopy that showed Crohns. Talk about weird since I don't have diarrhea. My only symptoms are upper GI problems, bloating, and excess gas. Well after I found this out I learned that crohns can cause BO. So I found this wonderful site that Jeff recommended for Crohns called "ask the specialist". The doc on this site is unbelievable. On his site he recommends that everyone take either culterelle or vsl#3. Now I had tried culterelle in the past and it increased my gas tremendously. So I tried the vsl#3. One study showed it possibly kept crohns in remission. Well I don't know what causes my symptoms. Is it IBS, GERD, Dyspepsia, Crohns, or some sort of infection causing inflammation. I haven't gotten to the bottom of it YET. What I do know is that Antibiotics followed by vsl#3 has cured my gas, my bloating is gone, and this bad taste I have had in the back of my mouth has disappeared. The cost is expensive. I forget how much but I was surprised. Something like $100 for a months supply. I know I will never stop it. Everyone should try it. I just don't know if it will work if not taken following antibiotics. I think the antibiotics get rid of the overgrowth and the vsl#3 changes your flora. Let me know if you try it.


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## Pete (Jan 20, 2000)

Snoopy,I did test positive for BO at Cedars and was told to avoid probiotics. To really complicate things I recently had a colonoscopy that showed Crohns. Talk about weird since I don't have diarrhea. My only symptoms are upper GI problems, bloating, and excess gas. Well after I found this out I learned that crohns can cause BO. So I found this wonderful site that Jeff recommended for Crohns called "ask the specialist". The doc on this site is unbelievable. On his site he recommends that everyone take either culterelle or vsl#3. Now I had tried culterelle in the past and it increased my gas tremendously. So I tried the vsl#3. One study showed it possibly kept crohns in remission. Well I don't know what causes my symptoms. Is it IBS, GERD, Dyspepsia, Crohns, or some sort of infection causing inflammation. I haven't gotten to the bottom of it YET. What I do know is that Antibiotics followed by vsl#3 has cured my gas, my bloating is gone, and this bad taste I have had in the back of my mouth has disappeared. The cost is expensive. I forget how much but I was surprised. Something like $100 for a months supply. I know I will never stop it. Everyone should try it. I just don't know if it will work if not taken following antibiotics. I think the antibiotics get rid of the overgrowth and the vsl#3 changes your flora. Let me know if you try it.


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## bellyknot (Jul 24, 2000)

Pete,Would you recommend getting tested for IBO first and treated with antibiotics? I's do anything to get rid of that rotten taste and the trapped gasthanksjudy


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## bellyknot (Jul 24, 2000)

Pete,Would you recommend getting tested for IBO first and treated with antibiotics? I's do anything to get rid of that rotten taste and the trapped gasthanksjudy


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## flux (Dec 13, 1998)

> quote: I's do anything to get rid of that rotten taste and the trapped gas


Trapped "gas" is*not* gas unless the gas becomes untrapped on its own eventually. No drug can get rid of gas that isn't there to begin with.


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## flux (Dec 13, 1998)

> quote: I's do anything to get rid of that rotten taste and the trapped gas


Trapped "gas" is*not* gas unless the gas becomes untrapped on its own eventually. No drug can get rid of gas that isn't there to begin with.


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## sarren (Sep 9, 2000)

Thanks for letting us know. I will try this out. (Although $56.00 for 20 packets is a little pricey!).Pete - do you have to take this once or more a day? DO you continue to take for a number of days pr forever?


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## sarren (Sep 9, 2000)

Thanks for letting us know. I will try this out. (Although $56.00 for 20 packets is a little pricey!).Pete - do you have to take this once or more a day? DO you continue to take for a number of days pr forever?


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## Blair (Dec 15, 1998)

Hey Pete , thats good news. You've reseeded yourself with a bacteria that doesn't bother you.When I first got sick I repeatly tried antibiotics followed with probiotics, no luck. Especially bad luck with Bifo bacteria. I'll have to try this new type you recomend.


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## Blair (Dec 15, 1998)

Hey Pete , thats good news. You've reseeded yourself with a bacteria that doesn't bother you.When I first got sick I repeatly tried antibiotics followed with probiotics, no luck. Especially bad luck with Bifo bacteria. I'll have to try this new type you recomend.


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## Pete (Jan 20, 2000)

I take it once a day. Could everyone post their experience with the product if they try it. It took about a week for results. The first 2 or 3 days gave me more gas but that subsided so you have to stick it out. Man do I hope I am onto something here. I keep praying that the gas doesn't come back.


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## Pete (Jan 20, 2000)

I take it once a day. Could everyone post their experience with the product if they try it. It took about a week for results. The first 2 or 3 days gave me more gas but that subsided so you have to stick it out. Man do I hope I am onto something here. I keep praying that the gas doesn't come back.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

What I found with a different probiotic product that worked for me was that initially I needed to take it every day to keep the gas away but after several months I could skip days and not have the gas come back.Assuming the same sort of mechanism is happening here (and since it is ecology and I don't think it matters that much which bacteria since they should all share some similar features but one species/strain may work better than others for any given individual) is that over time you may eventually get some ability to self-sustain the population of bacteria you want. Re-seeding those bacteria in may after that happens need to occur less regularly.I suspect it takes awhile to get enough colonies living on the lining (rather than just living in the stool) that they can keep the population going. In my case this took about 1/2 a year with a strain that altered my fart frequency from about 40 a day (mostly in the evenings---usually farted myself to sleep) to under 10 a day with no bedtime fart fest. Usually if I need to fart after lying down that is a signal to take some more (BTW I use Probiotica).K.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

What I found with a different probiotic product that worked for me was that initially I needed to take it every day to keep the gas away but after several months I could skip days and not have the gas come back.Assuming the same sort of mechanism is happening here (and since it is ecology and I don't think it matters that much which bacteria since they should all share some similar features but one species/strain may work better than others for any given individual) is that over time you may eventually get some ability to self-sustain the population of bacteria you want. Re-seeding those bacteria in may after that happens need to occur less regularly.I suspect it takes awhile to get enough colonies living on the lining (rather than just living in the stool) that they can keep the population going. In my case this took about 1/2 a year with a strain that altered my fart frequency from about 40 a day (mostly in the evenings---usually farted myself to sleep) to under 10 a day with no bedtime fart fest. Usually if I need to fart after lying down that is a signal to take some more (BTW I use Probiotica).K.


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## snoopy (Jun 24, 1999)

Pete,I e-mailed florence at VSL and she is going to send me some free samples to see how I react to this stuff. I don't know if I will have enough for a 1 week test...given your experience I would like to give it a week to see, since I will probably experience more gas in the beginning. I too reacted badly to "Culturelle", so after a few months on this stuff, I stopped taking it. My primary symptoms are bloating after I eat, bubbling/perculating tummy (especially where the small intestine joins the large if my anatomy book is right!), burping after I eat, heartburn and extreme fatigue/dizzyness. I also get diarrhea if I eat certain foods (ie. wheat, etc.).Gas is overall my biggest problem, so I am really hoping this VSL#3 is the answer. You are right- it is expensive, especially for a Canadian with the current exchange, but if it works and gives me my health back, it is worth it to me. I am finally being tested by a Toronto doctor for small intestine bacterial overgrowth with a breath test on Jan. 2nd, so I will let you know how that turns out. I am not starting the VSl#3 until after these results come back (probably mid-january) and will also let you know how I fare on this stuff. The best Christmas gift I could ask for is to be properly diagnosed and to get the right treatment! All the best over the holidays and thanks for bringing this product to our attention Pete!


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## snoopy (Jun 24, 1999)

Pete,I e-mailed florence at VSL and she is going to send me some free samples to see how I react to this stuff. I don't know if I will have enough for a 1 week test...given your experience I would like to give it a week to see, since I will probably experience more gas in the beginning. I too reacted badly to "Culturelle", so after a few months on this stuff, I stopped taking it. My primary symptoms are bloating after I eat, bubbling/perculating tummy (especially where the small intestine joins the large if my anatomy book is right!), burping after I eat, heartburn and extreme fatigue/dizzyness. I also get diarrhea if I eat certain foods (ie. wheat, etc.).Gas is overall my biggest problem, so I am really hoping this VSL#3 is the answer. You are right- it is expensive, especially for a Canadian with the current exchange, but if it works and gives me my health back, it is worth it to me. I am finally being tested by a Toronto doctor for small intestine bacterial overgrowth with a breath test on Jan. 2nd, so I will let you know how that turns out. I am not starting the VSl#3 until after these results come back (probably mid-january) and will also let you know how I fare on this stuff. The best Christmas gift I could ask for is to be properly diagnosed and to get the right treatment! All the best over the holidays and thanks for bringing this product to our attention Pete!


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## Guest (Dec 16, 2001)

Snoopy- probably a dumb question, but I'm new here: you were tested for Celiac, right?


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## Guest (Dec 16, 2001)

Snoopy- probably a dumb question, but I'm new here: you were tested for Celiac, right?


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## fred (Nov 22, 2001)

Pete, I'm still not clear on something: did you use VSL at one time and your gas was reduced, or do you use it even now?I ask because I that seems like a lot of money (20 days worth for 60 bucks) to spend indefinitely.


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## fred (Nov 22, 2001)

Pete, I'm still not clear on something: did you use VSL at one time and your gas was reduced, or do you use it even now?I ask because I that seems like a lot of money (20 days worth for 60 bucks) to spend indefinitely.


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## stinky too (May 21, 1999)

If it worked I wouldn't mind the cost but wondering if you need to get rid of the bad bacteria before you start this ?Right now my life is on hold if this works I would be foreven in debt to Pete.......


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## stinky too (May 21, 1999)

If it worked I wouldn't mind the cost but wondering if you need to get rid of the bad bacteria before you start this ?Right now my life is on hold if this works I would be foreven in debt to Pete.......


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## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

Hi pete







Thanks for sharing what worked for you. BTW did your CS docs finally decide it was ok to take probiotics even if you have BO . If so did they give you any reasoning? or did you go entirely by what this specialist on the internet site said. And what do the CS docs say now? Hope you don't think I am being too nosey. Just curious since we had some long discussions about what your docs thought. Its interesting- we have all been sitting on the fence about taking probiotics based on what your docs insisted. Thanks


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## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

Hi pete







Thanks for sharing what worked for you. BTW did your CS docs finally decide it was ok to take probiotics even if you have BO . If so did they give you any reasoning? or did you go entirely by what this specialist on the internet site said. And what do the CS docs say now? Hope you don't think I am being too nosey. Just curious since we had some long discussions about what your docs thought. Its interesting- we have all been sitting on the fence about taking probiotics based on what your docs insisted. Thanks


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## Pete (Jan 20, 2000)

I take it everyday. Bonnie I haven't talked to the doc at Cedar. They are great overthere but I am from NY. I pretty much went against what he said and tried it. It is true that other probiotics that I tried had no benefit. I am still not 100% sure if this is the solution. Like I said after antibiotics the gas would come back in 2 months. It has been 4-5 months now so I am just hoping I am onto something. Let me know if it helps you. I would tend to think an antibiotic should probably be taken first but don't know for sure


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## Pete (Jan 20, 2000)

I take it everyday. Bonnie I haven't talked to the doc at Cedar. They are great overthere but I am from NY. I pretty much went against what he said and tried it. It is true that other probiotics that I tried had no benefit. I am still not 100% sure if this is the solution. Like I said after antibiotics the gas would come back in 2 months. It has been 4-5 months now so I am just hoping I am onto something. Let me know if it helps you. I would tend to think an antibiotic should probably be taken first but don't know for sure


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## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

I routinely take antibiotics. So the next time I take them I am going to take probiotics. Since vsl#3 is expensive, I'll try something cheaper first. Actually I have had Culturelle and probiotica stored in my refrigerator ever since we started having these discussions. So I'll try those. Otherwise I will for sure be taking antibiotics again so I'll try vsl#3 then. I won't be able to tell any dramatic changes actually since with the medication I take the gas is already under control and its even better if I eliminate fructose but I am kind of preparing for when I'll be off those medications. Anyway Good luck to you. May your success last.


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## bonniei (Jan 25, 2001)

I routinely take antibiotics. So the next time I take them I am going to take probiotics. Since vsl#3 is expensive, I'll try something cheaper first. Actually I have had Culturelle and probiotica stored in my refrigerator ever since we started having these discussions. So I'll try those. Otherwise I will for sure be taking antibiotics again so I'll try vsl#3 then. I won't be able to tell any dramatic changes actually since with the medication I take the gas is already under control and its even better if I eliminate fructose but I am kind of preparing for when I'll be off those medications. Anyway Good luck to you. May your success last.


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