# is there a natural alternative to tricyclic antidepressants?



## paul762 (Jan 4, 2004)

thankyou


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Peppermint can act as an antispasmodic which may be part of the equation.Some people take St. John's Wort for depression have seen no studies with IBS, but I haven't seen great numbers of IBSers having luck with it.You can try Sam-E or 5-HTP supplements but I think the evidence for those is even less than for St. John's wort that it might have any antidepressant effect.Anything you try would probably be tested as an antidepressant and not for IBS to any great extent.Things that may work not acting as antidepressant would.Peppermint again as an antispasmodicFennel for gasGinger for nauseaProbiotics/Acidophilus for gasCalcium carbonate for diarrheaMagnesium Oxide for constipation.Fiber supplements...any of them.K.


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## paul762 (Jan 4, 2004)

thanks, but I was always under the impression that st johns wort was similar in effect to SSRI type anti depressants, and because im IBS-D type , I thought tricyclic might help more.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

I'm not sure if St. John's wort actually works all that similar to any class of antidepressants.I found this:


> quote:St John's Wort has been compared with older tricyclic antidepressants (e.g. imipramine and amitriptyline), and has generally shown fewer side effects than the tricyclic antidepressants. It would be useful to compare St John's Wort with newer antidepressants such as fluoxetine (Prozac) and paroxetine (Aropax) to see if St John's Wort works as well and if St John's Wort has as few or less side effects, as these medicines are used so commonly now.


 http://www.medic8.com/healthguide/articles/stjohnswort.html not sure what it means other than effectiveness was compared.Edit


> quote:It is not known how St John's Wort works. It is thought that St John's Wort may affect serotonin, noradrenaline and dopamine uptake.


sounds more tricyclic like than SSRI like to me. As those drugs tend to also effect the other neurotransmitters listedK.


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## overitnow (Nov 25, 2001)

I have been told it retards uptake and that griffonia stimulates serotonin production. I know of one that includes both ingredients. (There may be others. Check your vitamin store.) I do not know if it would be effective on your IBS; but, given the lack of side effects, it ought to be safe to try it out.


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## eric (Jul 8, 1999)

You don't also have to take pills or otc's, relaxation techniques can and do have the same effects on anxiety and the body. Some people require meds of course, but there are other ways which are usally more benefical long term.


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## skinny (Jul 27, 2002)

You should look into S-Adenosyl-L-Methionine (SAM-e).The Life Extension Foundation has one of the best overviews of depression that I've seen http://www.lef.org/protocols/prtcl-040.shtml S-Adenosyl-L-Methionine for Treatment of Depression, Osteoarthritis, and Liver Disease http://www.ahrq.gov/clinic/epcsums/samesum.htm skinny


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## eric (Jul 8, 1999)

SAM-e Claims, Benefits: "Natural" treatment for depression, arthritis, and liver disease. Bottom Line: Some studies suggest that SAM-e might be an effective treatment for depression, with fewer side effects than antidepressant drugs. But the real benefits and risks of SAM-e are still unclear. People with depression or joint pain should seek medical advice before trying SAM-e. If it works, it's a drug, and should be regulated and prescribed like one, as it is in Europe. Full Article, Wellness Letter, January 2004: Update on SAM-e Among the hundreds of dietary supplements on the market, a few stand out as worthy of intensive studyï¿½and one of these is SAM-e. Not an herb, hormone, vitamin, or any other kind of nutrient, SAM-e (S-adenosylmethionine) is a synthetic form of a chemical produced naturally in the body. It is essential to a great number of chemical processes, including maintaining cells, manufacturing substances used by the nerves, and influencing emotions and moods. Among other things, SAM-e supplements are sold as a "natural" treatment for depression, arthritis, and liver disease. SAM-e is said to be as effective for pain relief as aspirin, but without aspirinï¿½s potential to irritate the stomach lining. Itï¿½s said to be more effective than anti-depressantsï¿½and since SAM-e requires no prescription, you can be your own physician. In Europe, on evidence that would be considered inadequate here, SAM-e is sold as a prescription drug for depression, arthritis, and liver disease. In the American and Canadian marketplace, it is unregulated, like all supplements. Scientists have not neglected SAM-e, and in 2002 the U.S. Public Health Service issued a massive review of 90 studies of SAM-e. Nothing new came out of this huge effort, though ads from manufacturers may state otherwise. This government survey was not a clinical trialï¿½just a summation of trials, no matter how brief or poorly designed. The bottom line: More research is needed, including clarification of what an effective dose might be. What you should knowIf youï¿½re thinking of trying SAM-e, we recommend caution for the following reasons: ï¿½ So far the possible benefits and long-term risks remain unclear. ï¿½ Though its marketers boldly claim that SAM-e has no side effects, people taking high doses have reported headache, stomach upset, insomnia, and dizziness. ï¿½ If you are suffering from depression, you should seek medical advice before you dose yourself with anything. Depression is treatable but requires professional care. ï¿½ People with bipolar disorder should avoid SAM-e because it may bring on manic episodes. Itï¿½s not a good idea to use SAM-e to treat any form of severe depression. It can interact with anti-depressants.ï¿½ SAM-e will not repair liver damage brought on by heavy drinkingï¿½contrary to claims. ï¿½ People with Parkinsonï¿½s disease should avoid SAM-e.ï¿½ If you have joint pain, you might decide that SAM-e is worth a try, but donï¿½t give up conventional treatments, and be sure your doctor knows you are using this supplement.ï¿½ The most important problem: SAM-e is converted into homocysteine in the body. High homocysteine levels appear to raise the risk of heart disease.ï¿½ SAM-e may claim to be better than conventional drugs, but it is certainly not less expensive. Dosages of anywhere from 200 on up to 1,000 milligrams daily are recommended by manufacturers. This can cost from $2 to $18 daily, and you have to take it over the long term. This is great for those selling SAM-e, but it may not be so good for you.ï¿½ Because there is no regulation of supplements in this country, you donï¿½t know what youï¿½re getting. A recent test by ConsumerLab.com, for instance, found that one expensive brand contained only 30% of the claimed amount.Even if SAM-e were an effective drugï¿½and itï¿½s far from certain that it isï¿½you canï¿½t count on getting a reliable product with a standardized dose. And nobody yet knows what the right dose might be. *Parting thought: SAM-e is not a "natural" product and not a dietary supplement.* How the FDA can allow it to be sold as such is a big question. If it worksï¿½and thatï¿½s only a guessï¿½itï¿½s a drug, and should be regulated and sold as such. UC Berkeley Wellness Letter, January 2004


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## SpAsMaN* (May 11, 2002)

Is there a test to know the level of serotonin in our body?I can't beleive people dropping anti-dep pills without knowing if it will help.That's scary.Apparently,it is not the level of Serotonin itself but the mesenger who is the troublemaker.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

They can do a blood test for it (not sure if done clinically but some people have looked at this in clincical trials).I do know if circulating blood levels are a good indication of brain/nerve levels or could in any way give any indication if you have the right amounts in the right places (And it usually isn't total level that is the problem anyway it is not in the right places at the right times).K.


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## skinny (Jul 27, 2002)

Spasman:


> quote:Is there a test to know the level of serotonin in our body?


I'm not aware of any tests for the level of serotonin. Brain chemistry is still very complex, so it's uncertain whether there is a range of serotonin that is optimal.


> quote:I can't beleive people dropping anti-dep pills without knowing if it will help.That's scary.


Living life and making choices is a risk - taking an SSRI, taking an antibiotic, taking SAMe, driving your car to work, enjoying the beach at Phuket, Thailand on December 26, 2004 ...







...







You can't go on living life paranoid of 'what could happen.' Being too skeptical can be as bad as being too gullible.









> quote:Apparently,it is not the level of Serotonin itself but the mesenger who is the troublemaker.


I would agree with you here. Time for some slicing and dicing...







(continued)


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## skinny (Jul 27, 2002)

UC Berkeley Wellness Letter, January 2004vsLife Extension Magazine, 2003Round 1. Fight!!









> quote:ï¿½ The most important problem: SAM-e is converted into homocysteine in the body. High homocysteine levels appear to raise the risk of heart disease.


*LEF:* What other supplements would you suggest for SAMe users?*Brown:* There are many supplements you can take along with SAMe, such as folate, glucosamine chondroitin, etc., but SAMe works best in conjunction with adequate B vitamins, such as vitamin B12. B vitamins work synergistically with the methylation pathways in the brain and are required for making methionine, essential for the body's production of SAMe.


> quote:ï¿½ SAM-e may claim to be better than conventional drugs, but it is certainly not less expensive. Dosages of anywhere from 200 on up to 1,000 milligrams daily are recommended by manufacturers. This can cost from $2 to $18 daily, and you have to take it over the long term. This is great for those selling SAM-e, but it may not be so good for you.ï¿½ Because there is no regulation of supplements in this country, you donï¿½t know what youï¿½re getting. A recent test by ConsumerLab.com, for instance, found that one expensive brand contained only 30% of the claimed amount.


*LEF:* What suggestions do you have for people who want to start taking SAMe?*Brown:* One thing that really needs to be addressed is that while many studies confirm SAMe's efficacy, not all brands are created equally. There are many organizations out there that just don't offer quality supplements. Consumers really need to research the companies that they buy from. Companies like Life Extension and consumerlabs.com provide much of this information so that consumers can make an informed choice. Personally, I recommend Life Extension's products


> quote:Even if SAM-e were an effective drugï¿½and itï¿½s far from certain that it isï¿½you canï¿½t count on getting a reliable product with a standardized dose. And nobody yet knows what the right dose might be.












> quotearting thought: SAM-e is not a "natural" product and not a dietary supplement. How the FDA can allow it to be sold as such is a big question. If it worksï¿½and thatï¿½s only a guessï¿½itï¿½s a drug, and should be regulated and sold as such.


 skinnyedit: fixed a quote tag


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## SpAsMaN* (May 11, 2002)

Quote:Also, you can use SAMe in conjunction with the tricyclics to get better results. In this type of scenario, the doses for each are typically cut in half.Second quote in Contradiction with the other oneeople with bipolar disorder should avoid SAM-e because it may bring on manic episodes. Itï¿½s not a good idea to use SAM-e to treat any form of severe depression. It can interact with anti-depressants.







I do not claim that SAMe does not work, it's just this contradiction who makes me







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## flux (Dec 13, 1998)

> quote:Even if SAM-e were an effective drugï¿½and itï¿½s far from certain that it isï¿½you canï¿½t count on getting a reliable product with a standardized dose. And nobody yet knows what the right dose might be.


Ditto.


> quotearting thought: SAM-e is not a "natural" product and not a dietary supplement. How the FDA can allow it to be sold as such is a big question. If it worksï¿½and thatï¿½s only a guessï¿½itï¿½s a drug, and should be regulated and sold as such.


The FDA is stuck here. Congress allows these things to be considered "dietary supplments" even though they are not, and they cannot be regulated as drugs, which they should be. unfortunately.


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## skinny (Jul 27, 2002)

Spasman: My guess is that SAMe is just like other pharmaceutical drug like lithium. You got to play with the dosages to find the sweet spot. But then with bi-polar disorder, you should be more careful and seek professional advice if you're not self-educated.skinny


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## eric (Jul 8, 1999)

FYISAM-e - Too Good to be True?--------------------------------------------------------------------------------There is almost no available information about the product. It sells from anywhere between $16 and $38 for a bottle of 20 pills, which at the rate of two a day can burn a fairly deep hole in the wallet, especially when health plans don't pick up the tab. Nevertheless, more than enough people believe they are getting a bargain, particularly when it holds out the promise of bringing one back from the living dead, which is what depression is. The wonder pill is called SAM-e, and a recent book, "Stop Depression Now" by Brown, Bottiglieri, and Colman (Putnam, 1999), trumpets on its front cover: "The breakthrough supplement that works as well as prescription drugs in half the time ... with no side effects." Sound too good to be true? We are told SAM-e has been prescribed in Europe for more than twenty years and that in Italy it outsells Prozac. One of the authors of "Stop Depression Now", a psychiatrist at Columbia University, claims he has used the supplement on his patients with successful results for five years and another author has dedicated his life to research it. SAM-e - short for S-adenosylmethionine - is a molecule found in our bodies and is vital to a process called methylation, where one molecule passes a methyl group (one carbon and three hydrogen atoms) to another molecule. It's a transaction essential to more than a hundred processes in the body, from the brain to the bones. Levels of SAM-e are notably lower amongst depressed people of all ages. Because of the universal nature of methylation, SAM-e has also been found to work well for arthritis and the liver, and may have other yet-to-be discovered uses. As to how the process applies to the brain, scientists still don't know. Their best guess is that SAM-e may affect neurotransmitters such as serotonin and dopamine or their receptors, but then again they could be wrong. In all, there have been some 40 studies - virtually all European - involving 1,400 depressed patients that typically show SAM-e working in a matter of days (as opposed to four to six weeks with antidepressants) with virtually no side effects. A 2004 open-label Harvard study of 30 partial or nonresponders to their antidepressant found that adding 800 to 1600 mg/day of SAM-e resulted in 15 who responded and 13 who remitted after four weeks.The reason Americans have not heard about SAM-e much sooner, according to the authors of "Stop Depression Now", has to do with the economics of bringing a new drug to market. The massive investment in meeting FDA criteria was hardly worth the effort for a natural substance that could not be patented. But a law passed in 1994 changed all that. Now, any product with a good safety record can hit the shelves, and in 1999, for the first time, SAM-e became available over the counter in the States, with a veritable host of companies getting into the act. The authors are quick to note that SAM-e may not be for everyone, and that deeply depressed or suicidal people should only take the supplement under a doctor's supervision. But they do set out a program for self-treatment for the rest of the population, especially for those who are not inclined to seek help in the first place. Perhaps easy access to SAM-e is a boon to these people, particularly if their other option is to suffer in silence, but for the purposes of this article anyone who acts as his own doctor has a fool for a patient. Following are some general guidelines: Buy only from a reputable supplier. The over-the-counter market is virtually unregulated. According to an article in USA Today: "The market is getting cluttered with fraudulent product ... Some smaller players who want to make a buck are putting labels on bottles of baby powder."According to Nancy Stedman in The SAM-e Handbook (Three Rivers Press, 2000), Nature Made, manufactured in Italy by Knoll SPa, is "the gold standard." Other brands include GNC (General Nutrition Center), also manufactured by Knoll SPa, Nutralife, Solgar, Vitamin Shoppe, Natureï¿½s Plus, Mothernature, and Life Extension.SAM-e is chemically unstable. Donï¿½t take the pills out of their containers until you are ready to use them.Buy only enteric coated tablets, which prevents SAM-e from being broken down in the stomach, where it is useless.400 mgs daily (2 x 200 mgs) is the typical starting dose, which can be increased. Most studies have used 1600 mgs daily. Use only under a doctor's supervision. A doctor may recommend SAM-e in conjunction with other antidepressants. Do not stop taking after your depression has lifted. Like traditional antidepressants, SAM-e is a long-tern treatment, at least four months. Ask you doctor about using if you are pregnant or breast feeding. Do not take if you are bipolar. Using alcohol is permissible. And finally bear in mind how complex and subtle and downright mischievous depression actually is. Even if there is a magic bullet and even if that magic bullet is SAM-e, all your problems will hardly crumple overnight in the face of a pill-induced methylation onslaught. SAM-e is not retroactive. It will not replace your bad memories with good ones, nor will it take over the heavy lifting in changing sad thoughts to happy ones. But it may get you back on your feet again. It may, like more traditional antidepressants, bring you back from the living dead, and that certainly is a start http://www.mcmanweb.com/article-11.htm What is irritable bowel syndrome?Symptoms of Irritable Bowel Syndrome (IBS) include pain in the lower abdomen (below the stomach area), changes in bowel habits with frequent, urgent diarrhea or constipation, bloating, and cramping. It is a medical disorder of the lower ï¿½gutï¿½ (the stomach and intestines), which is one part of the gastrointestinal (GI) tract. It is thought to occur because of communication problems between the brain and the gut. Research suggests that people with IBS experience abnormal gut motility (changes in the rate of contractions of the gut muscles) and enhanced visceral sensitivity (an increased sensitivity in the brain to normal and painful gut activity such as painful swelling in the gut). It is not clearly understood what causes IBS. For some people it begins in childhood with a ï¿½sensitive stomachï¿½ that develops into more intense symptoms in adulthood; while for others, the GI problems start suddenly during a period of stress or persist after a parasitic infection in the stomach or bowel. Irritable Bowel Syndrome is very common. It is estimated to affect up to one in five Canadians, and occurs much more frequently in women than men. The impact on the individual and on society is significant. Life with IBS can be quite miserable. The pain, cramping and urgent trips to the washroom disrupt work and home activities. The bloating and gas are embarrassing so people often suffer in silence. IBS is the second most common reason for workplace absences. Over one-third of the patients that are seen by gastroenterologists (the ï¿½gutï¿½ specialists) have Irritable Bowel Syndrome. In Canada, IBS has been estimated to cost about $352 million in direct and over $1 billion in indirect health care costs each year. While many people think certain foods must be the culprit, there is no evidence to support the idea that IBS is a food allergy or food sensitivity type of disorder. Once IBS develops, however, the bowel is over-reactive to or easily triggered by a variety of things including diet, stress, emotional state, and even hormone fluctuations. Stress does not cause IBS, but it does appear to play a particularly important role in triggering IBS symptoms, likely because of the close communication via nerves and chemical pathways between the brain and the gut. In fact, two-thirds of healthy individuals without IBS report GI symptoms of pain or bowel upset in response to stress, and the numbers are even higher for people with IBS. Research suggests that both ï¿½acute stressorsï¿½ such as deadlines, exams, job interviews, or conflict with others as well as ï¿½chronic stressorsï¿½ such as financial concerns, time pressures, or family issues can aggravate the gut. Can Psychology Help?Absolutely. For those with milder IBS symptoms, use of over-the-counter medications and changes in lifestyle that ensure more regular eating and sleep routines, a healthier diet with increased fibre and water intake, as well as more regular aerobic exercise are usually sufficient to provide some relief. However, for those with moderate to severe symptoms, psychological and medical interventions are recommended. Treatments usually target specific symptoms (such as the diarrhea) or aim to decrease the triggers (for example, stress) that exacerbate the symptoms. Conventional medical treatment has included fibre supplements, antispasmodics, gut motility agents, and medications that act on biochemicals in the GI tract and central nervous system. At this point, reviews of the effectiveness of the medication treatments have concluded that they are helpful for small subsets of people with IBS, but have been disappointing overall in their impact. For the most up-to-date information on medication treatments as they apply to your situation, you are encouraged to discuss the use of these medications with your family doctor. Several specific psychological treatments have been found to be effective in providing relief of IBS symptoms as well as reducing the distress and coping difficulties that often occur when dealing with a chronic illness. These psychological therapies focus on ways to decrease stress and cope differently so that the stress doesnï¿½t ï¿½go to the gutï¿½. What Psychological Treatments are Effective?Four approaches have been carefully evaluated over the past number of years and have been found to be of benefit. These treatments are provided by professionals trained in psychological interventions for health problems. Relaxation training teaches ways to relax the body and mind. Cognitive Behavioral Therapy (CBT) incorporates a number of steps aimed at changing behavior to improve health and coping. It often includes information to ensure a better understanding of the illness, as well as teaching techniques to change thought patterns by challenging automatic, distressing and self-defeating thoughts that can trigger gut reactions. CBT also typically includes relaxation training. Hypnotherapy uses mental imagery to specifically reduce gut sensations and foster a state of calmness.Brief Dynamic Therapy focuses on significant personal relationships. In therapy, the individual is helped to identify and deal with challenging interpersonal situations and interpersonal stressors.Evaluation studies have typically shown that psychological treatment led to greater improvement than the usual medical treatment. As well, the psychological therapies have long lasting effects months to years after treatment was completed. Medication treatments, in contrast, tend to cease to have an effect when patients stop taking the medicine. Up to 70-80% of people with IBS have reported significant improvements following psychological treatments. Recent research suggested that the amount of improvement relates in part to the effort and time the individual puts in to develop better ways of coping. http://www.cpa.ca/factsheets/IBS.htm This summary has been created for the Clinical Section of the Canadian Psychological Association by Dr. Lesley Graff, Associate Professor, Department of Clinical Health Psychology, Faculty of Medicine, University of Manitoba, and staff psychologist at Health Sciences Centre, Winnipeg, Manitoba.


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## skinny (Jul 27, 2002)

SAM-e - Too Good to be True? http://www.mcmanweb.com/article-11.htm


> quote:There is almost no available information about the product. It sells from anywhere between $16 and $38 for a bottle of 20 pills, which at the rate of two a day can burn a fairly deep hole in the wallet, especially when health plans don't pick up the tab. Nevertheless, more than enough people believe they are getting a bargain, particularly when it holds out the promise of bringing one back from the living dead, which is what depression is.


There _is_ good amount of information on SAMe. You just got to look for it. The price is high right now because it's very expensive to manufacture it. It used to be higher a few years back, but manufacturers are getting better and reducing the cost of production.The FDA is too corrupt and mired in red tape to get good information out of product reliability. Consumerlab.com independently evaluates supplements and posts the information online. Full reports are available with a subscription. We need more companies like this one to make sure products pass quality assurance.Consumerlab.com reported:"11 leading SAMe products were bought and tested. One failed. It had only 30% of the SAMe promised on the label."Sample of products they tested that passed to their standards:
Nature Madeï¿½ SAM-e (S-adenosyl-methionine) 200 mg Dietary Supplement (200 mg SAMe in tosylate disulfate form per tablet, 2 per day)*
Puritan's Prideï¿½ Inspired by Natureï¿½ SAM-e S-Adenosyl-methionine, 200 mg (200 mg SAMe per tablet (form not stated), 2 per day)*
Vitamin Worldï¿½ SAM-e S-Adenosyl-methionine, 200 mg (200 mg SAMe per tablet (form not stated), 2 per day)* http://www.consumerlab.com/results/same.asp
The Life Extension Foundation also tested their products and here's what they found:


> quote:A growing concern amongst physicians and consumers is whether dietary supplements contain all of the active ingredients listed on the label. This apprehension is based on well-publicized analyses of commercial supplements showing considerable variation in ingredient quality and quantity.The Life Extension Buyers Club learned a long time ago that there were few ingredient suppliers who can be trusted to consistently deliver pharmaceutical grade ingredients. That is why the Buyers Club mandates extraordinary quality control measures in order to guard against the counterfeiting that has become so prevalent in the supplement industry.Life Extension introduced SAMe to its members in 1996, but the media did not recognize the nutrientï¿½s multiple benefits until 1999 when several books and numerous articles were published.In April 1999, a national news magazine was working on a cover story on the multiple benefits of s-adenosyl-methionine (SAMe). The editors of this news magazine were concerned about the quality of SAMe supplements on the market because this nutrient is so expensive and difficult to produce. The news magazine approached several independent analytical laboratories and requested that they assay popular SAMe supplements to verify potency. All of these commercial testing laboratories declined because they had not yet developed a validated analytical method to test for SAMe.The news magazine then approached Life Extension to perform these assays because we were known as the pioneers of SAMe in the United States. We were asked to analyze seven different brands of SAMe. We informed the magazine editors that our reporting might be considered biased since we sold SAMe, but they reviewed our track record and expressed confidence that they could trust our findings.*The results of our assays showed that two out of the seven brands had no SAMe present whatsoever. One brand used the wrong form of SAMe, while two other brands had less than 100% potency. Only Life Extension (our brand) and Natureï¿½s Made products had 100% of the right form of SAMe.* Many consumers who trusted the reputations of some very well-known companies were clearly not getting what they paid for.Do You Trust Your Nutrient Supplier? (LE Magazine Special Edition, Winter 2004/2005) http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2004/dec200...supplier_01.htm


Another article they investigated the sources of raw material of SAMe:


> quote:In 2004, new members reported that they tried commercial SAMe products but did not obtain the desired benefits.When our supplier was alerted to this, they investigated and found that SAMe raw material that does not meet scientifically accepted standards was entering the United States market.Most consumers are unaware that the SAMe molecule has two forms. One is the SS isomer (known as the active isomer) and the other is the RS isomer (known as the inactive isomer). All produced SAMe contains percentages of both isomers. The accepted potency levels for SAMe require a minimum of 70% SS (active) isomer content. Life Extensionï¿½s SAMe consistently tests at 73% or higher for SS (active) isomer content with 27% or less of the RS (inactive) isomer.There is, however, cheap SAMe circulating in the United States containing 47% or less of the SS (active) isomer and 51% or more of the RS (inactive) isomer (refer to table below for comparison). These low-grade products are 33% less potent than SAMe produced according to scientific guidelines. Apparently, the products with the lowest test results originate in India.*Life Extension remains vigilant in ensuring that our members are provided with the best quality SAMe. We are thankful that the United States Pharmacopeia (USP) will soon be publishing official standards delineating the isomer composition requirements for SAMe. This will finally provide an official standard by which supplement companies can assay SAMe raw material to ensure that it meets pharmaceutical consistency.*While there will always be unscrupulous companies willing to buy the cheapest raw material offered to them, Life Extension has found that reputable supplement companies want to provide their customers with active ingredients that provide real benefits. The problem with SAMe has been the lack of a reliable assay standard. Life Extension is not aware of any company that analyzes the isomer ratios (comparing the active SS isomer to the inactive RS isomer) of the SAMe material it imports.The following table shows the isomer ratios of Life Extensionï¿½s SAMe compared to other raw materials that are flooding the American marketplace. Defective SAMe Enters U.S. Market (LE Magazine Special Edition, Winter 2004/2005) http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2004/dec2004_supp_same_01.htm


... I love it when an organization stays on top of the latest developments.







You can price shop at Froogle and PriceGrabber: http://froogle.google.com/froogle?q=sam-e&...=Search+Froogle http://www.pricegrabber.com/search.php/cat...m_keyword=sam-e skinnyedit: fixed tag


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## SpAsMaN* (May 11, 2002)

Do you take it Skinny?Any bowel improvementS?


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## skinny (Jul 27, 2002)

I took the Nature Made Brand and the LE brand. It sure was expensive, but I didn't get any bowel improvement.The only problem I had with the Nature Made brand was that a couple of times I noticed the enteric coated tablets passed through my poop without dissolving in the GI tract. Maybe it was my IBS that caused it.







I tried SAMe for mild depression. I started at 200mg 2x day and quickly bumped it up to 400 2x day. After I bumped up the dosages, I got dry mouth for the first two days and then no side effects. I did notice a brain energizing effect from it, but unfortunately I didn't get to stay on it long because it is so expensive.skinny


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