# To psyllium or not to psyllium?



## Corydalis (Apr 27, 2013)

Feeback please, many of you are trying the diets out there, FODMAP, SCD, gluten free, wheat free, and some say no psyllium, that it may be feeding harmful bacteria that has overgrown in the gut, while others say it is essential for a clean and happy colon, that it helps pull bacteria from the body!

Would psyllium powder be better than psyllium hulls? I have done both, am on powder right now and quite happy with how it's working for me but am now afraid that it may be encouraging harmful bacteria!

Any thoughts folks, thanks.


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## Gooby (May 11, 2013)

From my personal experience, pysllium and all the related fiber products like Fibercon and Metamucil did nothing for me.

Fiber in general did nothing for me.

Even things like fresh spinach and fresh broccoli did nothing.

My problem seems to be that once the digested food gets into the colon, it slows down too much, and most of the water gets reabsorbed to the point that all I am left with are very dry pebbles. Which then clump together into a huge stool that becomes very difficult to pass without a lot of dangerous straining.

The only things that seem to work for me, for lack of a better word, are "moisturizers"-- things that pull moisture into the colon and keep the stool moist and soft so it can be passed without straining.

The trick is to try to find out just how much of the "moisturizers" to use so that it doesn't turn into diarrhea but just enough so that I can go without straining too much.

And here are the things that I find helpful to draw moisture into the colon:

1. PRUNE JUICE i use this as a last resort because it tends to spike my blood sugar, but when all else fails, this will work if you drink enough of it

2. MAGNESIUM CITRATE dietary supplement pills, not the stuff meant for colonscopies. I take one in the morning and one at night

3. SORBITOL this is the active ingredient in prune juice without all the glucose spiking sugars, an alternative to prune juice for diabetics. All you need is a small amount daily.

4. EXTRA VIRGIN OLIVE OIL if you eat enough of this with each meal, your stools will be softer and easier to go, eat too much and you'll have diarrhea. I make sure that I drizzle quite a bit of this oil on every meal. It seems to help keep me regular.

5. GROUND FLAX SEEDS fiber doesn't do much for me other than making the stools less likely to clump together into hard masses. Flax seeds tend to not raise my blood sugar levels significantly, unlike wheat cereals and breads.

Before I came down with diabetes I was able to eat lots of fresh raw pineapple. That always made me go. If you're not diabetic, it might be worth trying.

Once I got diabetes, I had to stop eating a lot of the foods I loved and I had to eat less food than I would normally eat to lose weight. It caused me to become very constipated, and I keep having chronic constipation unless I do the things I mentioned above.

I try to stay clear of the harsher laxatives so I don't become dependent on them.

Sometimes I have to resort to enemas and glycerine suppositories if I go more than one day without a bowel movement.

These are the things that have been working for me, they may or may not work for the other people reading this thread, but I just thought I would tell people about it.


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## AIRPLANE (Mar 15, 2004)

I would continue with the psyllium if it is helping- I wouldn't worry about what you read. When it comes to this stuff, there will always be so-called experts with varying opinions. If it works, don't change. I wish I could use psyllium but even though I tend to be on the loose side of things it can bind me up too much, no matter how much fluid I consume it seems like most of the fluid goes right to my bladder. If I didn't have to go to a job I could give it more time to try and adjust to it but I can't deal with being so backed up when I have to go out.

I hadn't heard about the feeding bad bacteria part- I've only read that it is helpful for the good bacteria. I did read many years ago that there were more cases of things like diverticulosis being seen in people who lived in places like Africa where the diets were naturally very high in fiber. Their rates of colon cancer tends to be low but the fiber supposedly can create too much pressure in the colons of some people- maybe people with weak areas?

But again, unless you notice any adverse issues, if it were me I'd continue with it.


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## Corydalis (Apr 27, 2013)

Gooby, thank you so much for your informational post, I think it will not only help me but others who read as well. I had always thought I was drinking enough water, but like AIRPLANE said, it seems to go to my bladder and not my poo!

Yes I strain and suffer especially when I travel!

Thank you AIRPLANE for your post as well, and I agree, if you find something that is working for you, and it is better than the alternitives, keep on. Interesting on the findings of diverticulosis in high fiber consumers...I think it is important for people to remember to get the oils, and oil based fibers, as Gooby said, we need that moisturizing.

I have taken two steps back now coming off from a 3 day trip, and desperately need to get regular and healed again! UG!


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## Gooby (May 11, 2013)

A few things I forgot to add...

For non-diabetics, these fruits, in addition to the pineapple I mentioned above, are good at reducing constipation...

1. Prunes, and if you can find them, fresh plums, and stone fruits like peaches, apricots, nectarines, etc.

2. Figs

3. Kiwi

4. Papaya

5. Green Apples

6. Pears

And here's one, you may have not thought of...

7. Avocados.

If you are diabetic, you may still be able to eat those fruits, but just make sure you test your blood sugar after eating them to see if they cause your blood sugar to spike. You might also try "exchanging" other carbs for fruits-- in other words, don't eat the other carbs you were going to eat, and instead, eat fruits.

For some unknown reason, I have found that fruits are far more likely to make me "go" than vegetables.

Also, as far as magnesium supplements go, magnesium oxide works just as well as magnesium citrate for the purposes of pulling water into your colon. And it is readily available in supplement form at most grocery stores.

Some people get the powdered form of magnesium citrate, and then take a very small amount with each meal, to keep that meal from getting a chance to dry out in their colon.


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## storyofmylife (Jan 26, 2013)

Gooby said:


> From my personal experience, pysllium and all the related fiber products like Fibercon and Metamucil did nothing for me.
> 
> Fiber in general did nothing for me.
> 
> ...


Initially, veggies did not do much for me and psyllium did absolutely nothing. Then, after a long time, I began to recover. Surprisingly, veggies and psyllium started working quite well for me only when I began to recover.

It was not 100% successful, but about 90%.

Thanks for the info, especially prunes. Adding to what you said about prunes -

http://healthyeating.sfgate.com/benefits-prune-juice-digestive-system-4099.html



> In an eight-week study that tested the effects of prune juice against psyllium, a bulk-forming soluble laxative, 40 people with chronic constipation had better results with prune juice than with psyllium.


Also see references below article.


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## Gooby (May 11, 2013)

storyofmylife said:


> Initially, veggies did not do much for me and psyllium did absolutely nothing. Then, after a long time, I began to recover. Surprisingly, veggies and psyllium started working quite well for me only when I began to recover.
> 
> It was not 100% successful, but about 90%.
> 
> ...


I think in most healthy people, fiber from vegetables are all that they need to stay regular.

And that's the way it used to be for me, too.

I hope I will be able to go back to normal like you some day.

I think there is something extra found in fruits that are simply not in veggies, and whatever it is causes looser stools, and as a result it helps to relieve constipation in people like me.

Prunes and prune juice have a very long history of helping people have a bowel movement, and so they have studied more than other fruits. They have found that prunes have a lot of sorbitol in them, and it is not easily digested by humans, so it moves into the colon and draws water into the colon, causing a bit of a laxative effect. The more you eat or drink of them, the more sorbitol that ends up in your colon. Too much of it will cause diarrhea. Get just enough and you end up with a soft, easily passed stool.

Other fruits have similar effects, though not as reliably as prunes.

Still, I remember when I was a child, if I ate too much of almost any fresh raw fruit, I ended up with the runs. There was even a rock band when I was growing up called Green Apple Quickstep, and that was what their name was referring to.

If I wasn't diabetic, I would eat a lot more fresh raw fruits, and this problem would probably go away for me.

I am currently controlling my type 2 diabetes with diet, exercise, and Metformin, and oral medication. I should probably go ahead and just switch over to injecting insulin 2 or 3 times a day, so I can go back to eating more fruits. Having chronic constipation is not doing my health any favors, either.

For those people who are not diabetic reading this, I say go out there and eat more raw fresh fruit and see if that helps you.


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## Corydalis (Apr 27, 2013)

Gooby, thanks for the replies on my post.

I have not had the kind of luck with some things that others have in producing the BM, like apples, blueberries and pinapple. I mean, sure probably if I ate enough of it, but then again enough of anything is going to hit the system hard enough to make it roll over! I seem to have the kind of system that gets use to something and then that thing that worked don't work any more and it's time to change it up again.

Sorry to hear that you are diabetic, my Mum in law was and I looked after her for some years. I would encourage you to do the shots, but please please please test test test. SO many people think that they can "tell" when their sugar is low, and in maybe 75% of times they can, but from what I have seen, and not just from my Mum, but from others who say this, they ALWAYS end up having an episode of low blood sugar from not testing regularly. What worked good for us was the sliding scale, it helped a lot. You still have to know and watch yourself and always factor in when your not feeling well.

My Mum also suffered C, and then she would have several days of D, and back again. She did not drink much water and she had many other health issues.

It sounds like you are health conscious and trying to do what is best for you now, keep it up, I know it is hard.

On the prune juice guys, yeah, it works for me, but only if I take it right away in the morning on an empty stomach, and then it will make me go like two or three times, but after about a week or two, it does nothing agian. I think I just have to figure out like three to five things that kick my system into action and keep alternating between them...all I know is thank god there is SOMETHING that works huh?

best wishes,


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## AIRPLANE (Mar 15, 2004)

Also, I have read many times that a lot of people with IBS have fructose intolerance- from things like fruit, honey, maple syrup and the fructans that is in wheat. I know I can count on maple syrup to give me cramps and D. I'm IBS-A and can give myself D or C. I tried the psyllium for about a week (again) recently. I am now trying Citrucel (again!). One thing I don't like about Citrucel is the citric acid and sweetening- I'm using the regular type which I've heard is better than the artificially sweetened type but I wish it came in plain like it used to. Anyway, I'm experimenting with magnesium. I read where one Dr. (Tierona Low Dog) recommended taking magnesium citrate with fiber if it initially backs you up too much and then hopefully you'll get used to the fiber. At first I naturally thought she meant the liquid type of magnesium citrate but forgot that magnesium comes in supplements. I have read that magnesium oxide is poorly absorbed- thus a laxative effect- but can be very irritating to the GI tract so Dr. Andrew Weil says to avoid it although I can see how someone with C might want to try it anyway.

So that's what I'm trying now- Citrucel and sometimes magnesium citrate, other times magnesium glycinate which supposedly is better absorbed and less likely to cause D. I have been reading Dr. Carolyn Dean's website about magnesium deficiency- she also worked on the book IBS For Dummies besides her books on magnesium. I have Pelvic Floor Dysfunction (I'm very tight in the chest, abdomen and pelvic floor) and likely adhesions. Those can interfere with both the GI tract and the Pelvic area. Magnesium is supposed to be a muscle relaxant so that is why I want a form of it that I will absorb to see if it might help with those issues, besides preventing getting too backed up from fiber. I also take Tramadol for the pelvic pain which can be somewhat constipating but then again, in my case. sometimes that's what I need! I have yet to find the happy medium. I also experiment with a lot of different probiotics- I definitely don't tolerate any that have prebiotics in them- too much cramping, gas, pain and usually D.


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## Gooby (May 11, 2013)

As far as I can tell, it seems like it takes a unique combination approach tailored to each individual. Everyone is different. Just don't give up. Keep experimenting until you find what works best for you.

I will probably have to start injecting insulin eventually. For now, I take the oral medication known as Metformin (1000mg twice a day), and I do a lot of exercise to burn off the sugars. And I restrict carbs as much as possible. The only carbs I currently eat are prunes, prune juice, kombucha, and the minimal carbs found in kim chi and raw kale, etc.

I do test my blood sugar at least once a day, sometimes I test before and after a meal, so I can see how much of a spike certain foods cause. Unfortunately, some of my favorite foods have had to be abandoned-- such as pasta, breads, cereals, etc. They produce a long lasting spike-- sometimes as much as 5 or 6 hours long. Prunes and prune juice, on the other hand, produce a quick spike that also falls back down to normal within a few hours.

With Metformin, I haven't had any low blood sugar episodes. It's another reason I don't want to go on insulin just yet.



Corydalis said:


> Gooby, thanks for the replies on my post.
> I have not had the kind of luck with some things that others have in producing the BM, like apples, blueberries and pinapple. I mean, sure probably if I ate enough of it, but then again enough of anything is going to hit the system hard enough to make it roll over! I seem to have the kind of system that gets use to something and then that thing that worked don't work any more and it's time to change it up again.
> Sorry to hear that you are diabetic, my Mum in law was and I looked after her for some years. I would encourage you to do the shots, but please please please test test test. SO many people think that they can "tell" when their sugar is low, and in maybe 75% of times they can, but from what I have seen, and not just from my Mum, but from others who say this, they ALWAYS end up having an episode of low blood sugar from not testing regularly. What worked good for us was the sliding scale, it helped a lot. You still have to know and watch yourself and always factor in when your not feeling well.
> My Mum also suffered C, and then she would have several days of D, and back again. She did not drink much water and she had many other health issues.
> ...


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## Queeniebee (Jun 3, 2013)

I'd just like to point out that diverticular disease is still very rare in Africa. The new cases that Airplane refers to are the result of the increasing Westernization of the continent and are seen only urbanized communities where diets tend to be lower in fiber: http://www.med.upenn.edu/gastro/documents/Lancetdiverticulardisease.pdf.



AIRPLANE said:


> I would continue with the psyllium if it is helping- I wouldn't worry about what you read. When it comes to this stuff, there will always be so-called experts with varying opinions. If it works, don't change. I wish I could use psyllium but even though I tend to be on the loose side of things it can bind me up too much, no matter how much fluid I consume it seems like most of the fluid goes right to my bladder. If I didn't have to go to a job I could give it more time to try and adjust to it but I can't deal with being so backed up when I have to go out.
> 
> I hadn't heard about the feeding bad bacteria part- I've only read that it is helpful for the good bacteria. I did read many years ago that there were more cases of things like diverticulosis being seen in people who lived in places like Africa where the diets were naturally very high in fiber. Their rates of colon cancer tends to be low but the fiber supposedly can create too much pressure in the colons of some people- maybe people with weak areas?
> 
> But again, unless you notice any adverse issues, if it were me I'd continue with it.


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## Corydalis (Apr 27, 2013)

Gooby, please please check your blood sugar more than once a day with type 2, and check out this sliding scale method for meals, it would mean going over to injections, which I can understand why you would want to avoid that at all costs, but it really is a more stable way of regulating the sugars and insulin balance. Good for you for checking on foods to see which ones affect your balance. The nice thing about the sliding scale is you can have some of the things that spike sugars now and then if you account for them on the scale. It's a little time consumeing counting carbs and sugars, but ultimately is healthier, when fruits and the occasional treats are considered. When our doc had us doing it, there were three scales, low dose scale, medium dose scale an high dose scale, we learned by logging blood sugars at each meal where Mums blood sugar base line ran in general and used the scale for that. It was usually the medium or high dose scale because she had other health issues and stress that caused her sugars to run higher. If she wanted to have a treat, we eventually learned how to account for it with the scale by knowing how many carbs were going to be consmed, where her blood sugar was before the meal, how long ago the last meal had been consumed and what it was so we knew about how long it would carry her. Its a constant job to log everything, but no matter what it is a super habit to get into, you are ultra pro active and self reliant and dependable if you do.

Best wishes to you,


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## bloatationdevice (Jul 1, 2013)

I mostly use Metamucil, and it does help in the morning for sure. Citrucel never did much for me. I've also tried the other types of fibers that dissolve in water, like miralax, but they did nothing. I'm going to try adding in some FODMAP fruits (stone fruits), and see if that doesn't help. Costco has some delicious plums right now...


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