# I have a problem...



## Popeye (Oct 26, 2001)

After almost 2 full weeks of COMPLETE remission, my IBS is back. It's really bad: constant constipation, pain, bloating, gases.I am on side 3 of Mike's tapes. I think that my belief in the tapes is not as strong any more. But, I don't know what came first: IBS symptoms back or my disbelief that the tapes can actually really help...I am having a problem with the side 3. I simply cannot visualize the spinning wheel. I am trying so hard to visualize it spinning at different speeds, but it's not working and I became very conscious of this inability to visualize the spinning...It felt sooooo good to be symptom free. But, the symptoms are back again. I hope they'll go away again, though....


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## LTL (Dec 18, 2001)

Hi Popeye,The problem may be that you are trying too hard. I also tried hard, & was told not to by Mike, Eric, & others. In the room with the wheel, Mike specifically tells you not to try too hard. After I relaxed & just tried to listen to the sound of his voice & the music (without paying much attention to what he's saying) I think it worked better. He's talking to your subconscious anyway, not your conscious.FWIW, I'm on day 84. Did you read the mind armies stuff? That can be one reason the symptoms are back, & it also tells why they'll go away again.LTL


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## Clair (Sep 16, 2000)

Hi Popeye,Just so you know I think a fair few people have experienced a temporary relapse into ther symptoms while doing Mike's Hypontherapy tapes.I know how frustrating and disappointing it must be, but its those mind armies at work trying to resist that positive change.Don't worry if your not too good on the visualisation thing, I'm not I just switched on the tapes and let them wash over me - as LTL says don't try so hard. Just lie back and listen.Hang in there - your doing great, keep at it and the benefits will keep on coming.Clair


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## AZmom1 (Dec 6, 1999)

Hi Popeye,I don't know if it's the same where you are, but here we have water and electric meters with spinning wheels in them. I always pictured a wheel like that, sort of a "gut meter." It works well for me.AZ


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## eric (Jul 8, 1999)

popeye, numerous people have had a setback, try just to let it go and read the mind armies post. The tapes helped you to be symptom free and they will reduce them again no worries. Really some people about half way through find this and it can be like the last hurdle before the mind kicks in an the mind armies except the changes for the better. Don't be dicourage this has hapened before and those people stuck with it and are doing excellent.Others are right try not to try so hard.On this its part of the mind that is fighting the changes and its in part, where your disbelief is coming from. You will overcome this."my disbelief that the tapes can actually really help..."Just fyi though if you really have some different symptoms or major changes, you might want to check with your doc.Let me know in a day or two how its going for you and don't despair.Also is there anything else in your life right now that is making an impact, have you changed anything? Treatments, foods or is anything major going on in your life? What's the weather like where you are at? Just have to ask.Will get you through this no problem.


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## *Luna* (Nov 19, 2001)

I picture a smaller version of a water wheel, like you see on a mill... something like that. Something that's big enough to make slight changes too if need be. Sometimes I think it looks like of like the wheel they spin at carnival games, a vertical one. Always a vertical axis on my wheels







Don't lose faith...we all have fluxuations and setbacks, regardless of what we are doing to get better. I've been having D today, but there are a few things that I think contributed to that (Taco Bell last night, fight with fiance today...bad combination!), and I know that tomorrow is another day


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## cookies4marilyn (Jun 30, 2000)

Hi Popeye...Been there; done that! Many of us have symptoms return from time to time, but they get weaker and weaker and farther and farther apart. Some folks did not have any improvement until well after full completion of the program, some months later, some experience relief right away. You have had IBS for a while, and it takes a while to get the symptoms at bay. Other factors in your life play a part as well.All good comments here for you... just relax, and don't even dwell on the words themselves; I did that too, and finally learned that when I just listened passively or even fell asleep, that it worked better for me.Read Mike's Compilation Thread; but to save you time, here is a portion that addresses your concern directly: Mike says:"Sometimes symptoms return and you think, oh no, the IBS is coming back, even worse than it was.....The fears you describe are (in my world ), called shadow fears. You are improving but still concerned that you might go back.This is natural, and a sure sign you are moving forward, since the fears are behind you, as you continue to move forward the fears become fainter, weaker and finally go.Also, remember that everyone, those without IBS, have digestive upsets from time to time; so it isn't necessarily the IBS."Mike's Post Regarding Perceived "Set-Backs" and "Mind-Armies" Metaphor****************At some time during the listening of the IBS program, symptoms come and go, andthere is good reason for this. Its easiest to understand if we use a metaphor.Lets set the scene:Imagine that the IBS that has been with you, and part of your life for so long, as aresident army of negative thoughts.The IBS program and its imagery and learning's as another army, an army of positive thoughts, that are going to displace the army of old negative thoughts.Comments:The learned thought processes of the IBS have become a part of you. They do notwant to change because they are fine as they are thank you very much. However, youknow that once the IBS is reduced, managed or even eliminated you will feel better. We are not born with IBS, somewhere in the development of things, not only has IBS developed, but it is retained by the thoughts of the subconscious. IBS sufferers run thoughts in their minds, sometimes before they even open their eyesin the morning, what's the IBS going to be like today, how am I going to get to work,what happens if there are traffic queues, what shops have toilets and many otherthoughts beside.The subconscious does not want change, because the IBS is familiar. It is part of the sufferers life. No matter how bad the pain, or the bloating or the inconvenience, you have a history of surviving it, and you have. So while it is uncomfortable, its not lifethreatening, so why should the subconscious want to change?The subconscious does not like change, and will resist it!! It will use excuse after excuse to 'do something else' with your time.Just keep persevering Scenario again:After a while of listening ( and the time varies ), the sufferer will begin to feel better, in reduction of symptoms, or frequency of presentation, or feel more relaxed or less anxious, or might not even be able to put their finger on the reason, but they feel better.This is a sign that the new thoughts, the new army of positive thoughts have begun todisplace the old negative thoughts of IBS.Once this happens - the new army of positive thoughts and new positive feelings beginto relax a little, they are making progress. However! As any general in warfare knows, if they are being beaten, they do anorganised retreat, and regroup, ready for another attack.When the old thoughts attack, Then the old thoughts come back, feeling as if they are just as bad as before.Comments:The fact that the old army of negative thoughts is pushing back is natural and normal.However, since the suffer has been feeling better, they are more relaxed, but then theybegin to feel how things used to be again, they are reminded of the old discomforts.In some people their bowel habit may change, but it is only temporary.Scenario:Again the new positive thoughts, fight back, they once again push away the old armyof negative thoughts, but the old thoughts are weakened now, they are fought back again.The subconscious really does not like change.Once again the positive army of thoughts are encamped, their position is strengthened.Comments:The subconscious begins to understand that it can still survive with the new positivefeelings, it begins to feel better too, and because of that, the subconscious, throughgentle learning realises that it is feeling better, the body is feeling better, and theoutlook and attitude of mind is better too. All these things come together to move the sufferer forward, reducing symptoms and frequency of presentation.Scenario:The old army of positive thoughts will fight back again, however the strength of theold thoughts is much less, the times that the old thoughts try and come back becomeless frequent.Comments.The establishment of new positive thoughts change the way the sufferer feels, in body mind and self. What you have described is not unusual, although not all listeners have this.In my world, what you have described in normal."***********Hope this information helps you a bit....Take care and be well...


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## zayaka26 (Jul 5, 2001)

Hi Popeye,I am also doing the hypno and can relate to what you are saying. However, the minute I decided not to try so hard things started to get better (even thought I have noticed a big difference since the beggining). Now I just fall asleep the minute I put my headphones on and of course that is better. I have not had major problems, only one time I had pain and many trips to the bath, and last Sunday I had D. That is all. Being sick just two times since November tells me I must be doing something pretty well.Do not give up on this. As skeptic as I am I tell you this has been a blessing. I really do not think anybody would believe me if I told them how I have gotten better, but the important thing is that I am feeling better. You started after me, so you still have a long way; do not give up, ok? Plus, you already have the tapes, what do you have to lose? If you felt symptom free for two weeks, then you were on your way.







Continue doing it and try not to be so hard on yourself.


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## Popeye (Oct 26, 2001)

Hello! LTL, Clair, AZmom1, eric, Luna, cookies4marilyn, zayaka26, THANK YOU SO MUCH!!!This place is like heaven, really. You have no idea how much your comments help.Marilyn, thanks for the "mind armies" stuff. I think I read about it before (not this particular post, though). It's so interesting. Many people who don't believe in hypnotherapy say that they don't have "irritable brain syndrome", but "irritable bowel syndrome". But, it is just amazing how brain and stomach communicate and interract, which is kinda hard to grasp in our Western culture(s) where we value dichotomies, clear-cut binary oppositions, one of which is certainly mind vs. body. Well, it seems, at the end of the day, that they are not two separate, disconnected things at all. Eric, I think that my stress is factor number one for my symptoms. I am having a really stressful time at the university (deciding what to do for my thesis), my father just got another prostate cancer (PSA)test back, which is not bad, but not terribly good either. I started seeing my ex-girlfriend again. I love spending time with her, but, again, I started thinking in terms of the "what if..." questions (what if I have to go?, what if I have gas, what if I am bloated?...). Automatically, that causes my stomach to act negatively. Also, yes, I changed my diet...Since I was in a COMPLETE remission for two weeks, I started eating burgers, pizzas, and chocolate much more than I did before. Then, I started worrying about the wheel thing and questioning again whether the tapes really help, or if we only think that they help, so that we persuade ourselves that we don't have problems, when in actuality we do...You know,...all these weird questions, and, boom, IBS comes back, as bad as before (if not worse)...Zayaka26,I also fall asleep constantly. For instance, today I fell asleep within 2 minutes of listening to Mike's voice.Luna, sorry to hear about your D day. I find that fights with my ex-girlfriend, or even just my anticipation of being with her aggrevate my IBS horribly. Which is crazy, in a way, since it means that she represents a problem for my stomach, not an improvement.AZmom1,I tried to picture all sorts of wheels. They just won't spin or change their speed. Funny thing...







Clair and LTL,I definitely won't try so hard. Thanks so much!







to you all!!!


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## eric (Jul 8, 1999)

Popeye, first of all I hope your dad will be okay.Quite a few of us have been in remission for years now and after finnishing you will continue to get better. It important to understand this is not the placebo effect but actually changing our thoughts and body chemistry.It is an established fact that the brain and the gut are both operative in IBS. Did you also by any chance read the IBS, Hypno, pet scans I posted? I can also help to explain this if you need help.also this is a good quick read for you. http://www.newiq.com/mentalnote/20010110.htm I figure the food thing was a factor, don't over due anything yet. LOL Introdue things slowly back and somethings just may effect you no matter what and those you just need to eliminate for good probably or eat them sparsely.Those what ifs will get weaker and weaker as you go and as the anxiety is turned down and the thought processes change on the subconcious level.Your not the first one who has had a setback, others have and in the end had a marked improvement in their IBS.Just realize those negative thoughts and then let them go you don't need them.







Take a break from thinking about the wheel for a couple days then come back to it. It is also in part up to our imagination and we can manipulte things, so you can picture a power meter if it helps any and skip the wheel image.The tapes will really help, in the begining it seems you did have a slight placebo effect (something to recgonize) along with the begining relaxation of the tapes but they will sink in and be excepted by your subconcious, but it can be very gradual and suttle, but really builds momentum.Stay positive and never worry about asking questions or any worries.







PS I said recognize that effect, because it is in part a brain gut interaction and shows how much effect the brain has on the gut. Although placebos don't last, but the HT will you'll see.


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## eric (Jul 8, 1999)

Popeye, hows it going now?


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## Popeye (Oct 26, 2001)

Hi, Eric!Thanks for the article.Actually, I am feeling much better again. I'm having a lot of stress in my life, but my stomach seems to be great again.Thanks again! By the way, I am on day 19 with Mike's CDs.


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## Michael Mahoney (Oct 11, 2001)

Hi All,Keep going popeye







reading this I think its great all the advise and the support, and te different ways that my words are interpretted by the individual listeners, the differnt examples of the spinning wheels etc.Also remembering the thais does not have to be had work







just listening to my voice, and the music







Best RegardsMike


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## Popeye (Oct 26, 2001)

Thank you, Dr. Mahoney!!!My stomach is behaving really, really well again. Last night I had a pizza and some chocolate cookies. This morning, well,...again...I had to have a piece of pizza. I will stop with eating "garbage", but...it's just amazing how nothing bad happens... I am not thinking about my stomach AT ALL. I am not worrying whether I should eat this or that at all...I just do it, and, then, whatever happens - happens. And, it's working great. Usually nothing bad happens, but even if it does, I am not stressing about it... I think it's the much needed relaxation that I am getting from the tapes (CDs).Thanks a lot again!


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## zayaka26 (Jul 5, 2001)

Hey Popeye, pizza huh?







Sounds you're doing great. I'm happy for you!


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## Popeye (Oct 26, 2001)

Zayaka26, thanks!Well, actually, it's not that great tonight, but it's understandable after 2 days of eating pizza. I'll cut down a little...Well, I am off to listen to side 2,...I think...


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