# Gut putrefaction - a cause of leaky gas



## yellow11 (May 14, 2011)

Hi everybody,

I d like to share a very interesting link I've come across recently. To give a bit of background there's this very good book called - Hard to Stomach by Dr John McKenna which I might have mentioned before on here. Anyway it opened my eyes to things like gut fermentation and putrefaction. Actually I got to see Dr McKenna and got tested for both, I was ok for the first one but there was a very high level of indicans in my urine sample which apparently is a sign that I do suffer from gut putrefaction. In case people are interested in doing these tests I know my samples where sent to a laboratory called Biolab Medical Unit in London (www.biolab.co.uk).

So doing a bit of googling I came across this site today -

http://chestofbooks.com/health/nutrition/Dietetics-4/Diet-In-Intestinal-Fermentation-And-Putrefaction-Autointoxication.html

Here's the bit that really jumped out at me, the first paragraph under putrefaction symptoms saying that putrefaction results - "in the formation of nitrogen and sulphur compounds *chiefly of the aromatic series*". That right there could be a scientific explanation for the cause of leaky gas for at least some of us sufferers on here.

However I should add two words of caution, at the end it said bread and milk could be a good diet for those who suffer from gut putrefaction but from both personal experience and from what I've read milk especially is a trigger for lg. Also I went to my gp about my tests and he said he couldn't vouch for them, he can't say how medially sound they are. But at least he didn't dismiss them as rubbish and for me anyway I really do think it's the most likely reason I suffer from lg.


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## embarrassed (Mar 15, 2013)

I disagree Pengu. If it wasn't for the gas being there, there wouldn't be the need to release it. I know for me, I'm lactose intolerant. I know GAS very well. It's a large amount that lasts all night. With this leaky gas, it's so small, that when it releases it tickles my anus. I have no control over it leaking out. With milk gas for me (had a mint chocolate chip shake at Arby's) it was large bubbles and I was able to feel the need to get up and go to the rest room and do my thing. 90% of my day, I do not feel the gas, nor the need to release the gas. It just leaks out. So, stop the gas stop the leakage.


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

Well I think the think is most people with gas (well every human on the planet has gas, but those with higher fart frequencies), even most people who have a lot of sulfur reducing bacteria (so really smelly gas) don't have leakage of gas problems.

Some people don't keep it in until they can have a controlled release. That you do not feel the gas, and it leaks out without your deciding to release gas is something that may be more an issue with what is going on at the outlet than the gas merely exists.

Now different bacteria in there, and to some extent different feeding of the bacteria (sulfur reducing bacteria can't reduce sulfur that isn't put into the colon from your food leftovers. Methane producing (which tend to be low in people with a lot of sulfur reducing bacteria) and hydrogen producing bacteria need the left over carbs, so reducing them reduces the gas volume. I don't know if it is possible to eat in a way to produce zero gas.


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## westr (Jan 27, 2012)

although im positive i have physical defect/s, something about this rings true. one time i heaved a bit without throwing up and tasted the contents of my stomach and the taste was that of the fbo smell. i get a bad taste in my mouth, kind of sour. and sometimes if im bad with diet i get a certain quality to my bm's, quite sour and alkaline, like bacon mixed with rotting veg. and why is it if it is a physical defect that we smell worse than people with full on incontinence? why do probiotics and acv help a lot of us?


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## Mikeydidit (Jan 2, 2012)

pengu said:


> Well then youre a special case. A majority of adults are lactose intolerant. A large number get gassy when they eat certain foods. The gas is not the problem its the releasing of it.


Spot on in my case.


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## tummyrumbles (Aug 14, 2005)

The average person has 14 fluffs. When I was at my worst with leaky gas, I had literally hundreds per day, it was non-stop. Anyone can tell this isn't normal. I kept eating loads of fibre thinking I was doing the right thing. It only takes one food that you're intolerant to to mess things up so there's not much room for error there. There's a lot of things that cause constipation like high FODMAPS, rice, refined flour, alcohol, too much fibre or just fibre of the wrong type. Once you work out your basic safe diet of foods that don't cause constipation, then you should be able to evacuate fairly quickly. Then it's a matter of introducing one suspect food at a time.


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## yellow11 (May 14, 2011)

You know in one way this debate about whether it's a structural defect or a bacterial/gut flora cause of lg is a bit depressing in that I've been on here since 2011 and remember having this exact same debate then. And I think I'm right in saying Amnegrl is on here a lot longer and again she was saying how she was having this debate years and years ago. If only some kind doctor or medical researcher could organise a proper clinical trial for lg sufferers and try and get some definitive answers. But seeing that lg isn't even recognised, I think, as a proper medical problem that ain't going to be happening anytime soon.









I should point out that while I genuinely do believe gut putrefaction (and it will be gut fermentation for others) is the reason for my lg and for an awful lot of other people on here I'm not saying it's the only cause thats out there, there's a fair few of us with this condition so it stands to reason there could a number of different causes. Like there have been posters complaining how sometimes they leak little bits of mucus or moisture from their behinds so obviosuly enough that probably means there could be a problem with their anal sphincter.

One more thing I'd like to mention about gut fermentation/putrefaction. Some have complained on here about having "brain fog". For years a massive tiredness would come over me now and again. I still would be like that now and again though it's gotten better since I've given up eating red meat. Another person who successfully cured his lg (www.mytummytantrum.com) said how in the years he had lg he often woke feeling hungover even though he hadn't been drinking the night before. Certainly g f/p would explain this type of symptom so if you have lg and feel really lethargic a lot of the time this is a very likely cause.


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## westr (Jan 27, 2012)

it seems its a common symptom across several different conditions. some have been cured through probiotics alone, some by surgery, some through counselling. some may think certain things wont help as they didnt implement it properly, some may have been cured through other means whilst believing it to be a different method they were currently focused on. it is weird when people abandon logic and are convinced that its a singular problem across the board and they know what it is and try to convince everyone else of it but I imagine it's a comfort for them. as though they may be out of control but they put themselves a step closer to it by at least knowing what it is they're not in control of.


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## yellow11 (May 14, 2011)

Hey Westr,

Well I'm assuming you're aiming those comments at me since it's under my post in which case i'm a bit taken aback as I've consistently said in this thread gut f/p is a cause of leaky gas but not necessarily the only cause, others as you have said had success going down the surgery route.

To be honest the reason I decided to start this thread is because i've noticed in the last while a lot of posters having been talking about surgery and related stuff which is fine and I sincerely wish them the very best of luck but I think the forum should offer a full spectrum of possible causes for people to consider especially the newer members.

It's interesting what you say about all those people being cured. I think it comes back to that point about the lack of clinical trials, without them we're just left with anecdotes which are may not be valid. Like I would be very surprised if someone was cured by probiotics alone, you can take all the probiotics you like but if you eat a lot of junk food they won't do you much good. And if someone is cured by counselling well it's more probable they've been cured of ORS rather than lg which is a real physical complaint. Most of the success stories I've seen are very much focused around diet. Hopefully some day proper research will be carried out into this though I would be too optimistic about that.

Anyone interested about the brain fog might want to have a look at this -

http://www.mytummytantrum.com/2013/09/18/auto-brewery-syndrome/

Your points about the danger of abandoning logic and all are well made Westr, I hope I haven't fallen into that trap. All I can say is that I can't vouch for what Dr McKenna wrote in his book or Jordan writes on his mytummytantrum blog from a purely scientific viewpoint as I have no expertise but I can say their opinions chimes with my personal experience of having this terrible condition for so long now.


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## westr (Jan 27, 2012)

wasnt aimed at you


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## Kathleen M. (Nov 16, 1999)

I guess my other question is why when I have full on foul gas (when I take iron tablets) that gas never leaks out. The only time there are comments are when I know I let off a silent but deadly.

And when it is bad it can clear a room.

Yes some people make a lot more smelly gas (which may be different than smelly stools by themselves in people without the extra sulfur reducing bacteria so may have just less volitle compounds in the stool) than others. But I don't think the anus has smell receptors and in normal humans with normal sphincters can tell what the gas smells like and lets certain gases out but would hold it all in if you just got rid of the odiferous compounds.

Now altering the colon bacteria may alter the amount of odor or the volume of gas to where the problem is less noticable as there is less to leak out. But plenty of people who fart a lot (like I was) never leak.


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## yellow11 (May 14, 2011)

Sorry Westr,

My bad. I feel like a complete eejet right now. I guess it's thought me a lesson in not being so sensitive, actually I agreed with the general points you were making only that I thought it was at my expense haha. This is going to sound like a made up excuse but honestly my odour levels have gone up in the last while so my nerves are a bit frayed, still shouldn't have rushed to judgement like that so my apologies again.

In general i really don't think there is anything wrong inside me from a structural point of view, like I never leak anything other than gas but your point is well made Kathleen. I know of someone myself who does kinda fart a lot but has no lg issues. Come to think of it I don't seem to have too much of the normal flatulence myself but I fear nearly constant lg







. Yeah it's a bit of a mystery alright.


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## rude boy (Nov 17, 2013)

The strange thing is I have constant farts but there 10% of the time stinky. I sometimes struggle to get a whiff of my own..... I know for certain I have mucosal prolapse which is why my stink is of poo not gas. I do eat a load of crap which I'm stopping but even with peppermint tabs my ass would just smell of crap and peppermint weird combination. Feels like I'm shittin a polo mint haha


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## Maria Slan (Jul 16, 2013)

It s anecdote or not depend on your points of view. Btw, if you want to ask for evidence and clinical cases, you, at first, need a lot of ppls have the sickness and a lot of them have been cured. But we could not have this, cause this is a rare sickness where just a few of us have this compare with the big population.

Do you actually think that ppls who said they re cured are telling the fake stories? They do not cause they have no benefits from that. But it could not cure you because of your different in conditions. Two years ago, a medicine cured me but now it could not. the conditions for me have changed.

Another example is one person said use the garlic enema. But did you know exactly how did he do it? how many amount of garlic? what time he did it ? ( this s important cause if you try to take away something in the body, it has it own cycle life. ppls do it after it lay the eggs must be different from ppls do it after the eggs've hatched). or they said use hot water and salt in sit bath, so what is the temperature and the time exactly?

That s the reason why their methods do not cure you, except you drink a med or do surgery cleaning, the best thing you could do, is classifying what it is 1st, later find the method. Not follow any method that you've found, not a good way. Sometimes may guess the wrong thing, it s ok cause many expert doctors guess wrong things about this conditions for years, doesn't it?

and you could not ask for exact text form those ppls, this is not thesis, dont ask for reference. No-one re going to spend their time googling back on 1000+ posts to show you a small paragraph, just because you donot believe in them (they re here for their problems not for curing you or educating you, or doing social network try to create a group and make friends). You can take it or not, believe it or not is your choice. All of that fancy sources for what if it have never cured anybody in this condition? Theory and Practical - I do prefer practical.


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